• Techniques
  • Recent lessons learned, new epihanies
2014/03/06 07:47:02
ChuckC
  At the prompting of our friend Danny I went out and bought the matching sub for my Yamaha monitors & then gave ARC a 3rd try (it has never worked right for me and I have owned it for a couple of years).  With the sub it seems to be dead on & I can hear what I am actually doing, makes me wonder what the hell I was doing before.   You can't really work on sound effectively without being able to hear accurately, kinda like trying to paint with a blindfold on.
 
    In the last week I have found that you can't take anything for granted or assume anything in audio.  I assumed that I needed to flip the phase on my bottom snare mic because I usually do.... Halfway through a mix I was wondering what the hell was with this snare?....  The phase was aligned fine, I threw it off by flipping it.
   I have found my tendency to throw compressors on certain tracks just because I had done so in the past it both foolish and unnecessary, Start mixing the track and if you need a compressor to control a tracks dynamic movement... add it then.   I am learning to stop watching frequency analyzers and trust my ears, they are getting me to a far better balance of sound than my eyes are capable of. 
   I have learned how finicky a kick can be in a mix sometimes....  It's often easier to automate the level of the few real hard hits then wondering why the compressor makes those ones sound more clicky...  It is squashing them and bringing up too much of the highs.
 
   I have found that I hate the loudness wars, The bands I record want it hot, I want it to sound good.  This compromise only serves to tic me off.
 
I am sure there are more and I will add to this later.  I have to get going to work!
 
2014/03/06 07:55:06
Guitarhacker
Very wise and astute observations.
 
I have a motto..... add nothing to the music that adds nothing to the music.  This applies to the writing process, the recording process, and yes, to the engineering process.
 
So many folks do exactly what you were doing.... they add stuff just because that's the way we've always done it as opposed to adding what they need and only when they need it.
 
Kudo's to you!!
 
Now grasshopper.... try to grab this pebble out of my hand without using a compressor.
2014/03/06 09:47:12
mixmkr
Inspiring post...I'll have to check out that sub too.  The guy I got my HS80M from kept it and would only sell me the speakers... (he's using it with his Focal TwinB's)... so that might say something.
 
Tip-toeing on "spam"....  I pretty much agree with what you're saying and sum it up in the link below with my vid.
thx for the insight and will be eager to hear what else you have to say...
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPYv7c7gzIE
2014/03/06 12:13:44
ChuckC
Herb, that's pretty funny.
Mixmkr, I like the video, nice set up, and good general advise. How do you like the HS8's turned on their side like that? H haven't tried it.
2014/03/06 16:10:08
mixmkr
Well... I haven't really compared the HS80M otherwise.  My JBL's used to be there and I thought this was a good setup for now.  I think I would actually prefer it though...getting the tweets out further, as I can't sit too close, as you might see from the pic....and it keeps me in the triangle.  If I could lower them, that would probably be my preference, but they ARE angled and I think less reflections off the mixer too.
In the [very?] near future, I really want to revamp everything...  Get the X32 Behringer board...or the smaller producer and the new computer  as SOON as I can first.  It's all working, but the need to upgrade is getting more and more overdue.  The computer wimpers with the video, so I'm hogging my wife's for now.  Also, I can't upgrade to X3 yet...because of the computer...so I'm a bit dissatisfied with that as well
Btw... if you have an expander... it makes the hand smaller and the pebble larger... in comparision.. MUCH easier to grab.
2014/03/06 19:44:02
ChuckC
LOL
 
2014/03/06 20:15:11
Jeff Evans
I am not sure about setting speakers on their side. The manual says nothing of being able to do that and that might be a little concerning. Usually if a speaker can be set sideways they will say something about it in the manual.
 
I personally feel the speakers in mixmks's setup are way too far apart. He would not be hearing the centre image so strong. Dual monitors is not always a good thing either. (do you really need them and can you work with one, that is the question!) Maybe a larger monitor might work. My speakers are about 41 inches apart and I sit that disatnce out from them too forming a really good triangle.
 
The speakers should be as far away from walls and things as well. If they are too close to walls and corners and things you can get into some trouble there too. They are too high in his setup as well. They need to be down with the tweeter right at ear level and pointing inwards. They will sound better that way as well.
 
You can get by with one Auratone speaker and I really like it directly in front of you right in the centre. Drive it with a mono L+R signal. You actually get more benefit from one rather than two.
 
You can have way too much gear right near and in the middle of the speaker setup. It is best off to one side. Keep the speaker monitoring setup simpler, way less cluttered etc. You will hear things a lot better as a result. His setup looks like the gear was all setup first and the speakers squeezed in last. Should be the otheer way around. Set up a perfect monitoring environment first and then fit in the rest of the gear in around that.
 
Just some suggestions Chris!
 
 
2014/03/06 21:57:10
mixmkr
Jeff Evans
I am not sure about setting speakers on their side. The manual says nothing of being able to do that and that might be a little concerning. Usually if a speaker can be set sideways they will say something about it in the manual.

"oddly" enough, the manual doesn't say to put them vertically either!  
 
Jeff Evans
Just some suggestions Chris!


ALWAYS eager to hear more and will thoughtfully take them into consideration.  However in this recent post, I pretty much strongly disagree with most all.  Your comments are greatly valued and the time spent commenting is MORE than appreciated.  THANKS, Jeff.
2014/03/06 23:15:36
Jeff Evans
The manual shows all the pictures of the HS8's upright so I guess that might be some indication at least.
 
I still feel that speakers that are down lower right on ear level pointing directly at you sound better than speakers that are up higher and pointing down. I have had them lower and pointing direct to me for many years where as you it looks like have not experienced them that way only up higher pointing down.
 
Once you get them lower pointing directly, you will like the sound more over time I can guarantee it and you won't go back. There is just something wrong when they are up too high pointing down. Everytime I go into a studio where they are that way I can hear it. Every one tells you to have the tweeters at ear level. There is a good reason for it. Up high is a compromise, simple as that.
 
The reason why I like one Auratone type speaker too is that it shows up mono compatibilty issues of course. Also it lines up all your parts behind each other. Making them harder to distinguish. It forces you to go to the trouble more of separating parts by sound a bit more. Having two smaller speakers still gives you the panning and you might decide to leave two things alone because they sound separated whereas in reality they may not be. (that sounds weird I know because everyone will think stereo is the way the music is being heard but not always. I believe you have to be prepared for your music to be put into mono at anytime and still cut it. It is not just a TV thing it can be an anywhere thing!)
 
And then there is the other issue of sounds panned extreme left or right. In one speaker those sounds may get lost a little and you will then be onto making sure they are still heard a bit more. On two small speakers you wont notice that as much because the separation will keep them heard.
 
2014/03/06 23:39:49
mixmkr
ha...you must think I'm sitting on the floor!  Last bean bag I had was in my van too!...any rate... mono speakers and tweets are for the weak at heart...
I prefer rigs like this that basically can shoot around a corner anywazz
Be blessed...
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