Good points AT.  I was on the phone today with my Sweetwater rep talking about compressors. I'd like them to offer Warm products as I love the WA12 and would consider a WA76 (1176 clone) too.  He got me looking at UAD plugins.  Bit of a new vista for me. Price of entry makes this a bit of a commitment, but there don't seem to be many complaints from people using the products.  Thoughts here? Do UAD PCIe cards and plugins work well with Sonar?

Some mixers are leaving their hardware behind since the UAD stuff is so good.  Easier recall and it is close enough.  still, even the most in-the-box  guys still have a few channels of great hardware for input.  UAD is cost effective when you add up the colors at once, but if you do much acoustic recording actual hardware is still a worthy investment.  So my previous arguement stands.  Still, having a great 1176 on the bass, neve on guitar and optical on vocals during mixdown is very temping, plus whatever else the card can do at once.  It won't help you when recording, tho.  Hard choice, my man.

hgj1357
Good points AT.  I was on the phone today with my Sweetwater rep talking about compressors. I'd like them to offer Warm products as I love the WA12 and would consider a WA76 (1176 clone) too.  He got me looking at UAD plugins.  Bit of a new vista for me. Price of entry makes this a bit of a commitment, but there don't seem to be many complaints from people using the products.  Thoughts here? Do UAD PCIe cards and plugins work well with Sonar?

I use the UAD stuff all the time. It's by far one of my best investments hands down. That said, I'm in the other camp from the other posts you've received. Mike made a mention of "In my opinion if you are not tracking with compression to add color then there is no point in doing it."
 
I totally disagree with that because not everyone wants or needs color. However, a little compression going to disc is wonderful for conditioning your sound. I use compression going in lightly on just about everything I record. So definitely invest in a decent outboard comp just to have a good signal to disc. Coloration, however, is subjective, not a necessity for everyone.
 
-Danny

I always get carried away!  I'm rethinking this a bit. Maybe the original thought of either a Drawer 4 ch, the dbx 1046 or the Rane C4 to get some unobtrusive compression and limiting for tracking. The UAD gear can be on the horizon and a WA76 or two after that. Baby steps!  I'm sure the UAD gear is better than the VSTs I have now, but frankly, the limiting factor now is me not the VSTs.

If you have the Sonitus Compressor that comes with SONAR you have a better operating, and better sounding, compressor than the 3 analog units you just mentioned.
 
If you have some of the Pro Channel stuff then you've already got really great compressors.
 
If I needed a cheap, relatively clean outboard analog compressor, I'd consider the FMR RNC 500.
 
The original RNC is nice for what it is but it is only stereo and it isn't going to like being pushed hard by your favorite preamps that you already own.
 
The Warm 76 looks interesting... it will be interesting to see if they sound as fat and warm as the originals.
 
best regards,
mike 

hgj1357
I always get carried away!  I'm rethinking this a bit. Maybe the original thought of either a Drawer 4 ch, the dbx 1046 or the Rane C4 to get some unobtrusive compression and limiting for tracking. The UAD gear can be on the horizon and a WA76 or two after that. Baby steps!  I'm sure the UAD gear is better than the VSTs I have now, but frankly, the limiting factor now is me not the VSTs.

To be honest hg, you really don't need anything spectacular as far as outboard comps go other than if you are trying to go for coloration. Like I said before, the coloration thing is just another flavor, it's not a necessity for everyone. I personally like to "color" my tracks once they are in Sonar...but only if I NEED to. See the way I do things, what I create and what I print usually remains the same.
 
Meaning, what I record will not change drastically with any coloration other than something that was meant to be colored for a special effect etc. I like the clean pure sound of what I put into my DAW or I wouldn't track it, know what I mean? So a coloration compressor isn't something that I always need, nor do I use it often, but I do have a few. My preference for compression going in is usually something cheap believe it or not because like I said before, I'm just using the outboard compressors to condition my signal a little.
 
For example, I like to take all my signals in at -6 dB peak. Whether that's right or wrong in the eyes of others, that is what I prefer and what I feel works the best for me. Now, if I used no compression at all going in, I'd still get -6 dB peak, but it wouldn't look or sound as consistent as it would if I comped a little at say 2:1 removing about -2dB of gain. We're not trying to squash anything here, just condition the signal a little more for consistency because to me, that little bit really makes a difference. From there, the compression I use from UAD, Sonar or whatever I choose, doesn't work as hard and will actually compliment the sound.
 
Could I not use the outboard comp and get the same results from the comps in Sonar? Yeah, but things will behave a little differently and I've just always liked the sound of a lightly comped track more so than no comp at all going in. If you are thinking of comping like I am, just about any compressor with threshold, attack, release and ratio will work. Me and 2 other engineers (1 is pretty credible that a lot of people would know) have a little secret we happened to share with each other. When we shared it, we cracked up and swore we'd never tell.
 
I'm willing to tell because my reputation isn't as known as theirs. LOL! But a lot of my conditioning compression going to disc comes from a few *gulp* Behringer Multicom 2400's and some dbx 163 over-easy comps. For the conditioning thing, they just work well for us. We barely use enough...but without them you can tell a difference. I have a few Drawmer comps in the studio. They are awesome and to me, definitely some of the best comps I've ever used. BUT...I'm not crazy about them for the "conditioning thing" I do. The reason being, the Drawmer comes to life when you jump on it. This is how it gets its sound. I don't want "its sound" at this point, know what I mean? This is the thing Mike was sort of referring to when he mentioned "coloration". There are times when you may not want that...and to me, this is one of those times. I don't need "the Drawmer sound" on my guitar tracks....I like them just the way they are. There's just something (and I wish I could put my finger on it) that these stupid Behringer and dbx 163 pieces do when used lightly that fits what I do going to disc. (and I never clip anything accidentally while using them)
 
That said, the Sonitus compressor is awesome and a comp that I STILL use all the time even though I'm stocked up with killer comps from UAD, Waves and the Sonar higher end plugs that are in PC. The Sonar plugs in my opinion, are awesome. I use them as often as possible other than when I want a little coloration.
 
Now there's that "coloration" word again. In THIS scenario, there are times when I want the sound a particular compressor will give me color wise. This is where the UAD stuff shines. I love the sound of the Fatso...nothing else sounds like it. I love the sound of the NEVE 1081's coupled with the NEVE 33609 compressor. These comps get used on instruments that sound great due to the enhancement they can bring into the mix. There's just something different about the UAD stuff to my ears just by having it on the track. Though it may be mind over matter, it sure does make a difference to me to where I can tell when I forgot to use something I may always use on a track.
 
But in all honesty, you should be able to get great results with the plugs you have stock in Sonar. I have done many projects with nothing other than Sonar plugs. Did they sound worse than when I use my go to plugs? No, just different really. Between the Sonitus stuff and the Pro Channel plugs...you should be fine. If you want a little coloration with a different sort of sound after you print, UAD will be awesome. If you'd like to condition your sound going to disc, just about anything will work. If you want coloration going to disc, you need a compressor with a personality that is known for coloration....and some of these, can cost a decent amount of money. Other times you can get lucky with cheaper stuff. That's really the best way to sum it all up. Good luck.
 
-Danny

Danny, don't you use just a touch the Behringer Compressor when tracking on the way in as well? I thought I remember you saying this in several posts in the past. I believe you also mentioned placing it in front of your guitar when using Amp sims. I have been looking at the DBX 163 or the RNC to do the same.

I actually use an old Behringer Tube Ultragain as my mic pre that sounds pretty good for what it cost me. It is a 2 channel unit with 4 tubes, 2 for each channel. Some day maybe I will pic up an expensive nice pre, but for my home studio, this unit has gotten me by just fine.

Great contribution Danny. A lot of useful stuff in there.  Myself, I've been recording on and off for 30 years. But more accurately, for one year 30 times - as I never seem to progress much! I am determined to develop my skills and equipment and while I realize that I can't just emulate everything someone else does, it does help sometimes to simply be told what to do.
 
Is there much difference between using a compressor after the external preamp and before the digital mixing desk, and using the compressor as an insert on the desk directly after the mixing desk internal preamp (set to 0 db gain)? If so, then this changes my position a bit. My reasoning for wanting a 4-ch outboard was convenience - not having to re-patch each preamp into a single ch comp.  If I can insert an outboard comp on any track with ease then I could get a 1 ch comp for color (a WA76 perhaps) and maybe use the X32's internal comps for clean compression - and add external comps slowly over time as needed.

It all depends on how much you like the "color" of the X32's line inputs and the send op amps.
 
:-)

I have nothing else to compare it to, so I don't really know. Do you not like them Mike?