2013/12/22 16:33:05
Jeff Evans
No I hear ya! Yeah I think if you got a nice one and put the sound through by all means. I have set it for limiting with a very high threshold so all it does it stops the digital system from clipping. Fast attack to catch it in time etc..Essential with some very dynamic singers.
 
The VU meter is perfect for setting bass levels. And with either 14 or 20 dB headroom you can still record transient peaks nicely and work on them later just as effectively. Being in 24 bit and all.
 
In a studio with slight baffling a good close up mic sound of an acoustic bass is possible with the DI being used for reinforcement. Just using the low end of the DI sound is effective in beefing up the acoustic mic sound. The spill is part of the mix sound.
 
2013/12/22 17:22:31
Beepster
The wave looks exactly like when I touch the pickup on my P with the string (because some dumbass broke the cover so one side is popped up... and no I'm not the dumbass). I didn't listen to the wave but if that noise is what I think it sounds like I'd use audiosnap, set the threshold so it only snags those clips and create a midi track. Then I'd cut those clips right out of the audio track and find a sample to replace it that isn't basically a pickup pop.
 
A lot of not so seasoned bass guys think that the pop of the pickup is how you do proper pop and slap (as I used to). It is not. You are supposed to get the pop/slap off the fretboard. Having it hit the pickup is okay as a percussive sound live because nobody notices (except perhaps the sound guy cursing under his breath). On a recording it's a freaking nightmare. If it is indeed the strings hitting the pickup get rid of it because it's no good to no one.
 
Of course you know I'm a hack but I do know that a string mashing into a pickup under the guise of "pop and slap" just does not sound good on tape because I've done it and it sucks.
 
Watch pro pop/slappers and you'll see their right hands are doing all the really dirty work at the bottom of the fretboard... not above the pickups.
2013/12/22 17:25:45
Beepster
And here's an idea (and I'm sorry I have not read the thread)... if you DO have a couple good pops/slaps in there you could sample them, do the MIDI replacement and Melodyne them to be the right pitch.
 
I of course have never done anything like that and have no fricken' clue how that would sound but theoretical it could work if you really wanted to go crazy on it.
 
Cheers, bro.
 
2013/12/22 18:57:03
gswitz
BatsBrew, I'm totally listening. I have a compressor that I didn't bring with me to make that particular recording. So it looks like I'll be applying limiting after the recording.
 
This was a bar-room recording where my phone dB meter was pegged at 130 dB. So it was REALLY loud.
 
I'll keep at it. I think I can end up with something listenable.
 
 
2013/12/22 19:26:34
The Maillard Reaction
Hi Geoff,
 
 Was it an acoustic double bass or was it a new fangled solid body stand up bass?
 
 I like to record bass with compression. I use a LA610 preamp with its built in LA2A style limiting amplifier. I like to use the limiting to get a specific sound. However, I don't see the merit of using a limiter to mask or hide a sound that I suspect is the result of a mechanical or electronic issue that can probably be eliminated in the future.
 
 Your signal levels are no where near clipping... so using a limiter to prevent clipping doesn't seem like a priority.
 
 Finding the source of those clicks seems like the way to go.
 
 After all, if you limit those clicks on the way in it will just be harder to find them when you use the wave editor to edit them out by hand. :-)
 
 I'm curious to learn more about the instrument.
 
 If it's acoustic double bass I'd opine that loose clip on mics or loose after market electronics are common issues.
 
 If it's a new style solid body... it still sounds like something is loose and clicking or knocking.
 
 best regards,
mike
2013/12/22 19:50:01
gswitz
Thanks, Mike. It is an acoustic double bass. I had to google for picts because I'd never heard it called a double bass before. What makes it double? haha. Anyway. I think some of the problem is the strings hitting the pickup in some cases, and the slap of the strings on the fretboard in other cases.
 
I haven't had much chance to work with it. I'm hoping to get some time tomorrow.
2013/12/22 20:42:38
Kev999
gswitz
I think some of the problem is the strings hitting the pickup...



So where exactly is the pickup?  Is it built-in or clipped-on?
2013/12/22 21:12:12
The Maillard Reaction
"What makes it double?"
 
I don't have an answer I know to be factual. It is what the Contra Bass has been referred to traditionally.
 
There are lots of things I can assume, and I think an easy clue might be found here:
 

2013/12/22 21:21:41
The Maillard Reaction
I thought this was interesting:
 
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_bass
 
 
"Slap-style bass[edit]
Slap-style bass is sometimes used in bluegrass bass playing. When bluegrass bass players slap the string by pulling it until it hits the fingerboard or hit the strings against the fingerboard, it adds the high-pitched percussive "clack" or "slap" sound to the low-pitched bass notes, sounding much like the clacks of a tap dancer. Slapping is a subject of minor controversy in the bluegrass scene. Even slapping experts such as Mike Bub say, "Don't slap on every gig," or in songs where it is not appropriate. As well, bluegrass bassists who play slap-style on live shows often slap less on records. Bub and his mentor Jerry McCoury rarely do slap bass on recordings. While bassists such as Jack Cook slap bass on the occasional faster "Clinch Mountain Boys song," bassists such as Gene LibbeaMissy RainesJenny Keel, and Barry Bales [rarely] slap bass.[33]
Bluegrass bassist Mark Schatz, who teaches slap bass in his Intermediate Bluegrass Bass DVD acknowledges that slap bass "...has not been stylistically very predominant in the music I have recorded." He notes that "Even in traditional bluegrass slap bass only appears sporadically and most of what I've done has been on the more contemporary side of that (Tony Rice, Tim O'Brien)." Schatz states that he would be "... more likely to use it [slap] in a live situation than on a recording—for a solo or to punctuate a particular place in a song or tune where I wouldn't be obliterating someone's solo."[34] Another bluegrass method, Learn to Play Bluegrass Bass, by Earl Gately, also teaches bluegrass slap bass technique. German bassist Didi Beck plays rapid triplet slaps, as demonstrated in this video [2]."
 
It seems like when I watch a bassist play in this style I can hear the acoustic sound of the slap and it has a lot of resonance and a short but palpable decay. I wonder if the sound seems sterile because it is just a direct out rather than a stylized percussion sound resonating through the body.
 
best regards,
mike
 
2013/12/23 07:32:36
gswitz
Mike, What you described in your snipped it EXACTLY what he was up to. This was incredibly helpful to me to read. I always learn so much here! You all are an amazing resource!!
 
Regarding mic placement on the bass, you can see it in this image. I don't know enough about mics on basses to be able to comment but the thing is visible. If you open the link, you can zoom in better.
 
http://stabilitynetwork.blob.core.windows.net/g-tunes/IMG_5253.JPG

http://stabilitynetwork.blob.core.windows.net/g-tunes/IMG_5255.JPG

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