Whew, fantastic job Daniel! How many tracks did you wind up having for this?
 
Just a question out of curiosity, but do you sometimes hear the vocals totally blowing the rest of the orchestra away? That's not a shot at your fine work....I've just never done anything as big as that and just wonder if it's something you'd automate or leave as it is. It sounds great to me no matter what, I just heard the vocals lashing out a bit to where I lost the music behind and was curious how or if you purposely handle that in this situation.
 
I've done mostly orchestra's for schools but never a choir and an orchestra. You sincerely did a fabulous job and I thank you for sharing it. Please don't take my comments the wrong way, I'm honestly trying to pick your brain a little here in case I'm ever faced with something like this. :) Great quality recording here! Happy Holidays!
 
-Danny

I'm so Baroque I can't pay attention? So why isn't this in the songs forum?

Just a question out of curiosity, but do you sometimes hear the vocals totally blowing the rest of the orchestra away?

 
I suppose it is rather vocal heavy for my taste as well, but there are a couple reasons for that.  One is Messiah is really a 2 1/2 hour vocal work with some orchestra accompaniment.  So it is rather appropriate, or "in character" maybe, to have the choir take over the balance from time to time.  There is not too much going on in the orchestra to focus on really.  Mostly staccato continuo chords and the occasional string swell.   If it were Beethoven 9 or Carmina Burana the balance would certainly be more balanced between the two.  In most cases I'd say an 80/20 ratio between mains and spots is what I shoot for.  This was more like 60/40.  
 
The second reason is because I know from past experience the director will want it that way.  I have found that choral directors disapprove when the orchestra is too prominent.  Who knows, maybe he'll change his mind and I'll get to remix it.  
 
I don't do too much in terms of automation.  It was only 4 channels, so there is not much possible in terms of changing the natural balance, not that I would try that unless there were major problems.  I did turn up the spots about 2dB during the solo voice arias and back down for the choir.  

Thanks for sharing Daniel.
 
I woke up in a hotel in the french quarter and this is great to listen to with my coffee. :-)
 
 
 
 
spelling

rumleymusic

Just a question out of curiosity, but do you sometimes hear the vocals totally blowing the rest of the orchestra away?

 
I suppose it is rather vocal heavy for my taste as well, but there are a couple reasons for that.  One is Messiah is really a 2 1/2 hour vocal work with some orchestra accompaniment.  So it is rather appropriate, or "in character" maybe, to have the choir take over the balance from time to time.  There is not too much going on in the orchestra to focus on really.  Mostly staccato continuo chords and the occasional string swell.   If it were Beethoven 9 or Carmina Burana the balance would certainly be more balanced between the two.  In most cases I'd say an 80/20 ratio between mains and spots is what I shoot for.  This was more like 60/40.  
 
The second reason is because I know from past experience the director will want it that way.  I have found that choral directors disapprove when the orchestra is too prominent.  Who knows, maybe he'll change his mind and I'll get to remix it.  
 
I don't do too much in terms of automation.  It was only 4 channels, so there is not much possible in terms of changing the natural balance, not that I would try that unless there were major problems.  I did turn up the spots about 2dB during the solo voice arias and back down for the choir.  

Ah I see, thanks for the reply. Glad you didn't take me the wrong way because this is seriously an awesome recorded piece. I've always wanted to do something like this, but never seem to get the choir part. I've done choirs and orchestras....just never both at the same time. Great work once again.
 
-Danny

Ah I see, thanks for the reply. Glad you didn't take me the wrong way because this is seriously an awesome recorded piece.

 
Thanks.  I try never take anything personally, especially opinions on sound.  I thought it was a good observation. I did have the spots a little down before, I had to turn them up quite a bit for the solo vocalists that it changed the orchestra balance slightly,  I had to affect the choir as well so the change wasn't so drastic between movements.  
 
Doing things live doesn't always present perfect circumstances and I have learned to live with tradeoffs, and if someone with good ears hears the issues, I try to have my alibi prepared.   

I woke up iin a hotel in the french quarter and this is great to listen to with my coffee. :-)

 
Darn, I was going to post a link to another recording I just did a couple weeks ago of a concert called "Java Bach" when I read this, but the group hasn't released it on Instantencore.com yet.  Stay tuned for the clever comeback....

Okay, helps to bug them about it:
 
Here is my coffee quip,  excerpts from Bach's Coffee Cantata. 
 
http://www.instantencore....tails.aspx?PId=5108020

bitflipper
Thanks for the details. Do you take the ceiling height into account when deciding how high to place the microphones, or is it just a matter of how high the booms will reach?
 
And why are string instruments usually recorded from up high, anyway? Seems like the best position would be down at ear level, where people are accustomed to hearing it. Of course, I've never listened to an orchestra from 10' in the air, so maybe it sounds much better up there!

 
You should spring for the box seats next time. :-)
 
The way I learned it, two reasons to mic large ensembles from above is to collect a better blend of musicians seated from front to back, and to get the mics further away from extraneous noises emanating from the audience.
 
 
best regards,
mike
 
 

rumleymusic
Okay, helps to bug them about it:
 
Here is my coffee quip,  excerpts from Bach's Coffee Cantata. 
 
http://www.instantencore....tails.aspx?PId=5108020

I just got off the road. I look forward to listening with fresh ears tomorrow morning with coffee!!!