Anyone notice this? The typical song structure was:

Intro:Verse:Chorus:Verse:Chorus:Bridge:Chorus:Chorus

Now they haven't done too much, but it's important. The above structure usually has a verse which builds. You can feel it building. Then the chorus drops and it's big and powerful etc.

The new structure is more like this, and it makes the chorus drop seem even bigger:

Intro:Verse:Pre Chorus:Chorus:Verse:Pre Chorus:Bridge:Chorus:Chorus

Now the idea of a pre chorus is definitely NOT new in any way. I get that 100%. But what is being done of late is all to do with the beat. The verse will build as though a chorus drop is about to happen, but then just when it's about to hit, they take it away. There is tension. You want it to drop but it doesn't. The anticipation is bigger. The drums all go. Everything drops back to a BARE MINIMUM. And THEN the chorus drops and it feels bigger than it ever could due to the huge change from a minimalistic sound to a maximal sound.

I'm not trying to suggest this specific Pre Chorus style is new either. I'm sure it has been around for YEARS. But it's becoming extremely popular these last 5 or so years I've noticed. Writers have seemed to really like this style of dynamic, and it makes sense. It really is a better kind of model for a pop song if you think about it - if you're looking at a generic structure. You can tell these pop songs are written intentionally around this structure for this exact purpose. It doesn't happen by accident!


Anywho, just an observation which I thought was interesting. I'm sure you can all think of plenty of examples. If not, I'll post some up for you.

I thought the proven pop structures were (and continue to be):

1) AAAA  (where similar sections are repeated 4 times) (i.e., "Amazing Grace")

2) AABA  (where B is a bridge-divergence or rest)  (i.e., "Somewhere Over the Rainbow")

3) verse-chorus (x 3 or 4) ... zillions of songs and hymns.

But I recognize a lot of rock songs do employ the: 


Intro:Verse:Chorus:Verse:Chorus:Bridge:Chorus:Chorus 


and 


Intro:Verse:Pre Chorus:Chorus:Verse:Pre Chorus:Bridge:Chorus:Chorus 


Of course, proven structures appeal more to 'common-folk' than to artists, I think (perhaps).  We artists like to 'one-up' 'common-folk' for our own ears, I suppose.  So we make things *richer* ... but more difficult to digest.

Tonight, I listened to the 'ending-credits' song for the movie "Oblivion".  It lacked both structure and coherency, IMHO; but was extremely artsy and beautiful ... with no structure, no hook(s), and no intelligibility.  Hahaahaha!

Philip


I thought the proven pop structures were (and continue to be):

1) AAAA  (where similar sections are repeated 4 times) (i.e., "Amazing Grace")

2) AABA  (where B is a bridge-divergence or rest)  (i.e., "Somewhere Over the Rainbow")

3) verse-chorus (x 3 or 4) ... zillions of songs and hymns.

But I recognize a lot of rock songs do employ the: 


Intro:Verse:Chorus:Verse:Chorus:Bridge:Chorus:Chorus 


and 


Intro:Verse:Pre Chorus:Chorus:Verse:Pre Chorus:Bridge:Chorus:Chorus 


Of course, proven structures appeal more to 'common-folk' than to artists, I think (perhaps).  We artists like to 'one-up' 'common-folk' for our own ears, I suppose.  So we make things *richer* ... but more difficult to digest.

Tonight, I listened to the 'ending-credits' song for the movie "Oblivion".  It lacked both structure and coherency, IMHO; but was extremely artsy and beautiful ... with no structure, no hook(s), and no intelligibility.  Hahaahaha!

I guess it depends on how you define 'pop'! Pop in general is just popular music. So your above examples would fall under that. But I'm meaning commercial pop. The stuff you hear on the radio that is thrust into our ears with lots of pitch correction and a massive team of writers, producers and record labels behind them. Little different :P

Some examples of what I mean:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02Qa5PH0tZY            soft pre-chorus at 0:52 drops chorus at 1:07
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzU9OrZlKb8    soft pre-chorus at 0:39 drops chorus at 0:54
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNoKguSdy4Y  soft pre-chorus at 2:45 drops chorus at 3:08


Three fairly different artists, all using this exact same technique to make the chorus drop with a bigger impact and to increase tension in the listener. I'd say a good 50% (picking numbers out of the air) of the more well known commercial pop songs like these are using it. Anything with this type of 'style' seems to really use it heavily.


I'm not saying it's a bad thing or anything. In fact, I might even have a go at doing it with some of my own music which is much different to this stuff, but it'd be cool to drop everything back to just a piano or acoustic guitar strum before everything kicks back in.

It's like the phase we went through maybe 10 years ago where the second last chorus is played with just drums and vocals and the bass and the rest of the instruments are dropped out. Then they come back in hard. I've noticed that's going out of fashion now. Or maybe I'm just perceiving it as a phase and it has always been round (I'm sure it has been round MUCH longer than 10 years, but I don't know about popularity of it). Come to think of it, I have a section like that in one of my songs hahaha

Tonight, I listened to the 'ending-credits' song for the movie "Oblivion".  It lacked both structure and coherency, IMHO; but was extremely artsy and beautiful ... with no structure, no hook(s), and no intelligibility.  Hahaahaha!

I unfortunately missed listening to that song. But DAMN I loved that movie... So GOOD!

I am guessing that someone had a big hit with that particular song structure and then the band wagon got jumped on.  That is the way is seems to usually go.  For years, The Beatles/ George Martin arrangement style kind of became the base structure.  


I guess I should put more thought into structure when I write, but I kind of just do what naturally comes out when I make the arrangement.  I know that I have on occasion consciously decided to start with the Chorus, instead of Verse.  The biggest thing I try to do is make each section a little different by changing something up, instrument or vocal, so as to not repeat the same over and over.

I listen to the music in film & TV as well... there is some really good music there. Even the stuff in a few commercials is really smokin'!!!


On structure.... yeah there are dozens of structures in use but a few tend to be more popular than others. 

One thing I have noticed is that the standard 3 verse and a chorus form is fading a bit.... the new standard does seem to be 2 verses with pre-chorus (PC) and a killer chorus.

Another popular structure involves the use of the bridge. I love a well crafted bridge. It's not something that fits or works in every song, but where it does fit, it works magic like nothing else can. 

I like to try to vary the structure in the songs I write, using bridges and PC's when possible, though they must be a natural fit.  As I start to write, I really do not plan out the structure ahead of time. I write, the song as I feel it coming to me. If it has a PC or a bridge, well, that;s simply how it worked in that song. The next one might be a simple AABA form. 

I often find myself writing songs that have no chorus.... verses and a bridge...... which is another structure altogether but not very popular in commercial music for obvious reasons.... people like a big satisfying chorus.  one song of mine which I felt was well written was turned down for this very reason by a Nashville publishing house. They wanted a chorus and asked me to rewrite it with a chorus. Major revisions like that change a song totally. It's still setting in my soundclick waiting for the inspiration for the rewrite. 

I'm working on one now..... very close to finishing it, that has the typical 3 verse structure and a PC to every chorus. The cool thing about the PC is that it is not generally restricted to having the same lyrics every time as the chorus is generally expected to have. The PC in my new tune has slightly different lyric each time.... to match the verse preceding it better. The chorus is the same...... until the last when it is still the same but has a different "overlay" on it. You'll see what I'm talking about in the coming days. (hopefully by middle of next week)  I'm needing to rewrite the 2nd half of the 2nd verse, or perhaps the entire 2nd verse since I'm not satisfied with it's flow. 

No matter the structure.... when you hit the chorus, no matter if it comes straight from the verse or from a PC... the chorus has to be HUGE.... it has to have a noticeable increase in power, energy, and it has to satisfy..... with a big payoff. Lyrically, the questions get answered there, and the song makes total sense, as all the verses are now tied together. It is supposed to be the orgasmic moment in the song. All the tension in the verses and PC's are leading to that moment. 

Song structure is such a fun topic. 

Side note: It doesn't matter what structure you use.....one piece of advice I was given on songwriting from a Nashville writer was to be into the chorus before 60 seconds including the intro, and keep the intro's as short as possible, not to exceed 13 seconds (average). (for commercially aimed tunes) 

Having no commercial aspirations myself, I've found it quite liberating to ignore the entire concept of song structure. I'll do 60-second intros; just when you think it's an instrumental the vocal kicks in. Sometimes I have no chorus, just a variation on the verse, and it may not repeat at all. 

Maybe it's my prog-rock heritage, or just a short attention span, but I like to listen to music in which I don't know what's coming next. My favorite novels and movies are the ones that make me go "whoa, I didn't see that coming!"

mattplaysguitar

Tonight, I listened to the 'ending-credits' song for the movie "Oblivion".  It lacked both structure and coherency, IMHO; but was extremely artsy and beautiful ... with no structure, no hook(s), and no intelligibility.  Hahaahaha!

I unfortunately missed listening to that song. But DAMN I loved that movie... So GOOD!

+1; Oblivion is now one of my fav movies of all time (like "Dark City"); I studied that song to realize more its producer fx's... like verbs, distortions, consonant and dissonant harmonies of music layers plus vox.


The vox-femme, while stellar, got drowned (sweetly) in the mix ... like her timbre-excellence became redundant for the sake of the song (or something).


Yeh!  I realize current commercial-pop structure paradigms are excellent structures to study.  I've written a lot of songs emulating them ... especially after my structure-weak songs needed uplifting.

Wow, if Oblivion is up there with Dark City you've got my attention! Dark City is, IMO, on par with Blade Runner, A.I. and Gattaca for great science fiction in the classic vein.

mattplaysguitar - I'm in accord with your observation.

Thanks for posting the links to songs that illustrate what you're describing.

I think another example that impresses me with concise song structure in this style is Keep On Lovin You by REO Speedwagon.  Dated song now I suppose, but a nice example of this kind of thing.