I was wondering, how in the heck do you choose your tempos? I find it quite odd that, the more I learn about electronic music production, the more I notice that people tend to use un-rounded-number tempos, such as 123BPM or, even more weirdly and to the point, something like 119.84 (which I read in a well-known magazine). Why would one do that? Does it appeal more at a subconscious level, as opposed to a more rounded number (to the nearest ten)? It's definitely not a matter of tempo, since there's not an awful lot of difference between 123BPM, 119.84BPM and the tidier rounded number of 120BPM... Even if you're recording actual physical instruments - unless you're recording a totally spontaneous jam-session where no metronome is utilised, or unless it's your intention to play how you feel like and then tap in the tempo later for mixing purposes - you're still setting the metronome at a particular tempo; how do you choose that? Any thoughts about any of the above are very much appreciated!

I think it is important that if you are doing electronic pieces and you are not 100 % sure what the final tempo is going to be, it is good to stay in purely midi or virtual instrument mode and not render any audio or record any audio at that point.

Then you can change tempos very easily and find the right tempo in the end for your piece. And it is easy to work at something for quite a while at the wrong tempo and not know it. You may get the idea to change it away from the project as well. 

Before creating any audio it is a good idea to spend some quality time on the tempo and making sure it is right.

There is quite a lot of difference between 123 BPM and 120 BPM by the way. I am a drummer and can feel that big time. But 119.84 and 120 well that is bit of BS there I am afraid. That difference would be very hard to pick even for someone sensitive to tempo such as myself. I will tell you where 119.84 might come from though. A project that starts out in one DAW and is migrated over to another for completion. It may have started out at 120 BPM but in the other DAW the tempo may have to be altered very slightly to say 119.84 in order for the metronome in the second DAW to still be on the money right at the end of the piece as well as the start. It is possible for two DAW's to have a very slightly different view of how fast 120 BPM actually is.

There are supposed to be some magic around tempos that are multiples of 12 but I think all the tempos in between are just as valid.

Hi Jeff, thanks for your detailed reply! I'm a drummer too and yes, I suppose in that scenario there is a bit of a difference (although I'm more used to faster BPMs, being a metal drummer, so maybe I'm a little 'blunted' to smaller differences in tempo). However, I was referring more to electronic dance music where (in my humble and probably meaningless opinion) the main kick-drum beat really does not sound siginificantly different at 120BPM or 123 BPM; I've tried this myself... 5BPM is more tangible, so I've started rounding to the nearest 5, instead of tens, but I still really don't see the point in not rounding at all (as far as dance music is concerned)... Also, the 119.84BPM actually comes from an article talking about 'chart hits' and this being the 'magic number' for all current chart successes; and not an article on software DAWs or anything of the sort... I have a feeling I shouldn't take everything written in magazines (however widespread and successful) as gospel... Regarding the staying in MIDI mode, I do do that (as much as my computer allows), although I've seen in many tutorials that prolific producers tend to record everything immediately as soon as they've settled on a particular riff, sound or kick; which I have tried to emulate and honestly I find it to be somewhat of a nuisance... Would you be able to expand on those "magic around tempos" you mentioned? And how are they magic? Does this refer to the subconscious effect they may have on the listener, or something more tangible for the producer such as decreased phase damage etc.?

That's an interesting fact however, that two DAWs may have a slightly different view of what tempos are and that the tempo may change if importing projects from one DAW to another... Maybe in that case, they figured out that tempo by calculating it on a different DAW to what the tracks were made on, or maybe using a hardware metronome and/or tapping the beat: thusly the irregular number (?)...

Hey Mike I am still not sure about 119.84 being special compared to say 120 BPM. We are talking a difference of 0.16 BPM! And that is in a tempo of 120 so we are talking now a change of only 0.1% change in tempo. Do you really think you are going to feel that.

Creating audio parts early is OK if the DAW in use is OK at time stretching. I use Studio One for example and all you have to do there is alter the project tempo and all the audio files get time stretched perfectly to the new tempo. But even as good as it is I would not be wanting it to be making major changes in tempo though. Small perhaps. 

I use quite a lot of external midi (hardware) as well as virtual so I think it is possible to avoid audio all together for quite a time before settling on the tempo. I work like that a bit if I am involving synths a lot. But if it's a band I think it is better to get down to sorting out the tempo pretty early.

Anything related to 12 is good isn't it! Tempos of 120, 132, 108, 96, 84, 72 etc are all good! I am not sure about that really. I think you have to just feel it where it should be and be prepared to fine tune if necessary. 

Yes you do sometimes have to alter the tempo in a second DAW to keep things right. You start by setting it to 120 BPM as you would expect and at the start the second DAW metronome is perfectly in time but not right at the end. In this case the metronome will be early right near the end of the piece compared to the music in the second DAW. Early means the second DAW is playing fast and you might have to shift the tempo down very slight amounts eg 119.84 and then everything will line up again nicely. Not sure but I think in Logic you can set the tempo to 4 decimal places.  This is also when audio is involved not midi only for obvious reasons.

Another place where weird tempos show up is in film scoring. Sometimes you have to alter tempos very small amounts to meet up with hit points perfectly as well.

My point exactly (re 119.84 vs 120)! Very weird... Thanks again for your help :) I'll try out the multiples of 12 for sure! I in fact have always very much liked 240BPM for no particular reason previously to this thread, so... Very interesting!

Right, I see! (re DAWs, tempo and metronomes)

Makes sense about the film scoring, too!

I have run into a case where my part of a song was recorded at 120BPM in SONAR X1 and when I took it to my partner's studio (using Adobe Audition), the tempo registered as 119.86....and it did make a difference in the project.  I had to edit the clarinetist's audio wave in spots to keep up with the song if I remember correctly.

As discussed above it is most likely related to the precision of each DAW.

Alternatively, it might have to do with the fact that a digital transfer was made and somebody did the math to make sure their project was sample accurate.

A 44.100 kHz sample rate results in 44,100 samples in 1 second.

At the 44.100 kHz sampling rate, one measure at 120.00 bpm (2.0000 seconds) will contain 88,200 samples.

At the 44.100 kHz sampling rate, one measure at 119.84 bpm (2.0027 seconds) will contain 88,303 samples.

That is a difference of 2.3356 milliseconds per measure.