Thanks, that answered my questions.

Though I'm confused about one thing still. Why does K-meter have a different scale than the real scale? 

Well that is because if you have a digital type K meter you will see the scale above 0dB VU. For example if you are working at K-14 then the scale is normal up to 0dB VU but there is another 14 dB of meter scale above 0 dB of course. That means you are working in the headroom area now and you really should not be in that area much or for long.

The VU meters (real ones) don't have that. I can only really see another +3dB above 0 dB VU but I don't mind that. I can generally get the music to just reach 0 db VU most of the time and it rarely goes above that. If it does then you have to look as to why etc.. 

I can and do also use both the real VU and something like the BlueCat meter which does show the headroom scale above 0 dB VU as well if I really need to see what is going on in that part of the scale.

I still am confused about the comparison of the different meter scales.

What I know which might be wrong is that -6db on the k-12 scale is equal to 0db on the real scale. So on the K-12 scale the recommended headroom space is between -12db and -6db. Going past -6db on the k-12 scale would clip.

VU meters are a type of RMS meter? 

Okay, maybe I should just try and learn the simple things first.

I have the Blue Cat's Digital Peak Meter. What RMS levels should my range be as a general rule of thumb using the normal system and not the k-systems?

are you talking individual tracks, or stereo mixes?

do you want high RMS average, or do you want to control peaks only?

do you want your music to be full of dynamics, and have wide ranging deep sound, or do you want it flat and undynamic like the majority of major label releases today?


rms energy depends solely on the source.

after that, if you decide to tame peaks before conversion, you will need an outboard compressor and/or limiter.

after that, once the signal is in the DAW, youi can further apply more compression, and limiting, to wrestle the RMS average into whatever range you see fit.


the point of all this, is to get your sound into the daw in a matter that does not distort, and does not bring up the noise floor (by greatly amplifying a weak sound)

me, i watch my peaks, and worry not about RMS

i track with peaks at -12db typically.


i also track with outboard compression.
sometimes i use it for PEAK control, sometimes i use it for subtle compression, sometimes i use it just for color.

my RMS averages about -20 to -22 on a track per track basis.

i know this, because i use the meters, and i also do things occasionally to check my modus operendi, such as outputting individual tracks and running it thru the analysis portion of my mastering software (Wavelab)

"are you talking individual tracks, or stereo mixes? "
So your RMS would be -20 to-22 on per track. stereo mix as in master bus? Yes I would like to know on master bus. 

"do you want your music to be full of dynamics, and have wide ranging deep sound, or do you want it flat and undynamic like the majority of major label releases today? "
full of dynamics, and have wide ranging deep sound. But I don't want to see a huge difference between the RMS in my project and the RMS they use in major label releases today.   

"after that, if you decide to tame peaks before conversion, you will need an outboard compressor and/or limiter. "
You mean a limiter at the end of the master bus fx chain so it doesn't clip? 

"after that, once the signal is in the DAW, youi can further apply more compression, and limiting, to wrestle the RMS average into whatever range you see fit. " 
Would a normalizer do a good job for this? 

 "do you want high RMS average, or do you want to control peaks only?" 
 I watch my peaks, and try to keep my RMS at a robust healthy level.

"my RMS averages about -20 to -22 on a track per track basis. " 
So that would be around -10 to -8db on the k-12 scale?

sharpdion23


"are you talking individual tracks, or stereo mixes? "
So your RMS would be -20 to-22 on per track. stereo mix as in master bus? Yes I would like to know on master bus.  

  that's per mono track. master bus and individual track meter status read exatly the same, assuming no processing on the bus.

"do you want your music to be full of dynamics, and have wide ranging deep sound, or do you want it flat and undynamic like the majority of major label releases today? "
full of dynamics, and have wide ranging deep sound. But I don't want to see a huge difference between the RMS in my project and the RMS they use in major label releases today.   

IMO, you can have one, but not the other. the only time you see rms close to matching peak, is on source that has very little dynamics, such as a synth tone.

"after that, if you decide to tame peaks before conversion, you will need an outboard compressor and/or limiter. "
You mean a limiter at the end of the master bus fx chain so it doesn't clip?  

once you've gone thru conversion, you have what you have. software after conversion is an entirely different issue.

you cannot limit with software, to affect your INCOMING signal before conversion.

"after that, once the signal is in the DAW, youi can further apply more compression, and limiting, to wrestle the RMS average into whatever range you see fit. " 
Would a normalizer do a good job for this?  

no. do not use normalizing.

 

"do you want high RMS average, or do you want to control peaks only?" 
I watch my peaks, and try to keep my RMS at a robust healthy level. 

 
if you drive your RMS upwards, you also drive your peaks upwards, unless you process with compression and limiting.

"my RMS averages about -20 to -22 on a track per track basis. " 
So that would be around -10 to -8db on the k-12 scale?

see the chart i provided.

So if I add Blue Cat's Peak Meter to a track using the normal scale, your recommendation is for the RMS to stay close to the -20db to -22db mark. Also making sure my peak levels don't hit the clipping point.