Thanks for the info.

Trying to setup a template for myself in X1 so its all there as my starting point (Im forgetful LOL)

This will help a bunch

digi2ns


Take the Bass for example

Set the leave the main EQ 350-4500 alone

Slope the HPF 350 down to somewhere in the 40-60 range

LPF 4500 and up


Am I think correct as a starting point

Hopefully the explanation above will clear up some things... I think you read something into the color chart that wasn't applicable.






The 4 string Bass guitar starts at 41Hz and goes up to 350hz for it's fundamental content.


So I often set a lo-cut slope centered on 20-30hz for the bass so that the low E string and all the other undertones can sound full.


If it's direct I don't worry so much about a hi-cut because there not so much to worry about... if it's from a mic I use a hi-cut to remove any fluttery room weirdness but try to make sure I don't cut into the lively character of the bass overtones and player's touch.



In either case the hi cut will start well beyond the 350hz top end I mentioned above... it'll be a lot further up because the overtones on a bass are so important to it's character.


Have fun!!!


best regards,
mike

"digi2ns"
I dont see a legend for it on the chart. (wouldn't mind having this chart to post up on the wall either )

The October 2012 edition of "Sound on Sound" has a very nice "Audio Frequency Chart" glossy insert (approx. 18" x 24"). I have to say that it would look real nice either laminated or plasticized on the wall. Check it out if you can still find that issue in a mag. store.

I've had this chart printed and hanging on the wall for some time... it does come in handy.


I'm with Bat. Use the HP/LP where and when you need it. I almost never assume something will need a specific treatment right up front. I try to listen not only to the track soloed but more importantly, in the context of the mix with other tracks. 

I may not need to cut the acoustic guitar if nothing else is in the same freq band with it.  I think on Footsteps, where the guitar was kind of like the only thing there.....it was a full range, no cut track. 

If I have a piano and several acoustics, I pretty much assume I need to cut and start from that reference, but the cut on this project may not be exactly like the cut on the last project. Each one is slightly different. 

But.... inquiring about cuts.... that shows that you are on the right track.... cut before boosting. It's amazing what cutting a freq can do that all the boosting in the world can not. 

I hpf/lpf damn near every track I record. Use your ears WITHOUT hitting that solo button I know you want to hit. (Even though I do it once in a while)

It has not been mentioned much yet but is very important and that is the slope of the HPF and LPF. You need to decide what sort of slope you need. You will get a very different sound if you set a HPF at say 70Hz and have a slope of 48 dB/Oct compared to setting it at say 200 Hz and use a slope of 6dB/Oct.

If a sound or track has too much bottom end in it, a shallow slope like 6dB/Oct but set higher can be just the ticket for taming that low end and bringing it back to normal. On the other hand a track that has got some silly subsonic rumble in it but you want to preserve all the bottom end in the sound may require a setting of 60 or 70Hz but with a very steep slope after that.

You need to decide what the HPF is going to do for you. Is it going to ease out too much bass or kill very quickly any subsonic material. You need to think about that first and then decide the slope that is required. And of course the HPF needs to have a wide range of variable slopes. If it doesn't then don't use it but insert a better one instead.

The only way you can tell is use your ears and listen on your monitors. That is going to tell you what is going on. Be careful not to thin out sounds too much as well. It is a big mistake that people make. They thin out everything except the kick and bass and the mix sounds like that too. You still need bottom end in many tracks it is just about how much that is important. 

Thanks Jeff

I was just playing with that.

Say for instance I had a snare with some rumble in the lower end of it that I could actually hear. I set the slope steeper and adjusted up and down around the 125-175 range just until I believe it was cleared up.

Are there somewhat certain slopes for certian items, like the Bass being less steep compared to an acoustic guitar. 

Ive been doing like you suggested and just trying to hear what adjusting each track is doing and it seems to be doing like what you are explaining. The end result is its appearing to give it a more defined result with out loosing to much out of each track and loosing what I think I hear is to much boomyness or low end noise.

the chart also comes as a big fold out poster in Mastering Audio by Bob  Katz - essential reading

I also use a HPF on every track. Most of them with exception of the Kick and bass are set from about 80hz up. Kick and bass for me are set at around 40hz although they may go lower if need be.

As someone mentioned earlier it's all about how it sounds in the mix. There isn't much useful in most instruments below 40 hz and a lot of sub sonic frequencies are just energy that create rumble low down rather than add anything to the overall sound.

The human ear is great at reproducing missing fundamentals so you can actually have HPFs set higher than you might think. I tend to solo an instrument and sweep the HPF frequency up until I can hear it take something away from the instrument. I'll roll it back a little from there and that then becomes my starting point for that track which may well get increased as I start to mix and perhaps need to make space for something else.

I usually find an instrument that sounds good soloed will sound crap in the mix and vice versa.

A great book that will answer just about every question you may have on EQ as well as every other aspect of mixing is "Mixing Audio" by Roey Izhaki. It comes with a DVD full of audio examples that are referred to in the book and it is worth every penny. IMHO.

Mike, you got some good advice above and some that I don't agree with. So I'd like to share a few things that I feel are important.

There is NO starting point. Don't believe it, don't buy into it and don't practice it. If you record a sound that doesn't have enough low end in it to start, you'd not just high pass 100 Hz.

Let's look at a guitar. Some guys are into high end sizzle thinking a tone is more distorted because of it. You know...like picture a sound recorded without speaker sim or something. Razor sharp, harsh and usually without much bottom end at all. Taking out 100 Hz or even 150 Hz "just because that's my starting point" will totally destroy this particular sound.

Kick drums....*most times* unless you're dealing with bass drop kicks or dance kicks, 20 Hz ain't gonna do a thing. If you have to high pass that low, you made a mistake during the recording process. I've never recorded a kick drum in my life that needed to be high passed at 20 Hz or even up to 30 Hz. I see 0 activity in those ranges on a freshly recorded kick drum whether it be from a sample or a real mic print because I make sure I don't print a sound with subs that low. 

A good/properly recorded bass guitar is going to hit in a similar low end area as your kick but it can go from 30 Hz and even reach up into the 130 Hz range for low end. That 30 Hz depends on if it's a 5 string with a low B and you actually play the low B in the song or you decided to push 30 Hz via eq pre-print. We do it no justice high passing 30 Hz if there is no 30 Hz rumble in the tone. See my point? It all depends on WHAT YOU record that determines WHAT YOU remove.

You wouldn't high pass a dance snare from an 808 kit "just because" of a starting point. You wouldn't use a starting point high pass on toms if the sound you recorded doesn't have low end "woooosss" or a rumble of low end air so to speak. You would just look for the offending frequency and curb it if it exists. You have to know when to high pass something and when to sculpt a particular offending frequency because if you just high pass, you can remove the good stuff in a track.

So my point is, identify where you need to high pass before you "just do it". Don't listen to "I usually"' from people because they are NOT dealing with the sounds YOU are recording.

When you high pass, you will hear a blanket of lows that sort of sound like wooooooossss or wussssssssss in the background if you listen close. You sweep your frequencies with a good amount of high pass going on until you indentify where it is and then hone it in and back it down.

The same with low passing, but the sound you'll be looking for is sisssssssssssss, eeeeeeeeeeesssssss or shhhhhhhh and you'd just sweep through the frequencies to find out where it's coming from. When you low pass, identify that the instrument needs it. Some don't have harsh high end to where they need it removed.

In THIS particular situation, I actually recommend soloing things up for high passing because if you don't, you'll never hear the blanket of wooosssss in the background that is cluttering up and masking your other instruments. But for low passing, you should be able to get away with handling that without soloing up your instruments.

Once you get used to this and know what to look for and listen for, you won't have to solo things up anymore...which you really shouldn't do unless there is a problem area. But until you know how to listen for these artifacts, solo up if you need to. Just try not to get into instrument sculpting while in solo mode. You're only soloing here to listen for the low end artifacts in the background. Hope some of this helps....good luck.

-Danny