I'm wanting to get some opinions on studio monitors. Mine (HS80Ms with a KRK Rokit 10s sub) are currently the only pieces of 'prosumer' gear left in my studio, and I'm wondering if it's worth upgrading. I don't know anything about speakers, so have a few questions which I'll try and break down into manageable chunks.

My big question is, what do we pay more for in high end studio monitors?
- from what I gather, transient response is one thing?
- better bass response? I've heard that pretty much all rear ported speakers are no good with low end material - would that still apply to me, given my sub takes over at around 70Hz?

I guess my main thought is, if you get to know a certain pair of monitors, is there any point in 'upgrading'? Would I be able to produce better mixes with more expensive monitors because they will allow me to hear things that I had not been able to hear previously with my cheap Yamahas? This is kind of a stupid question, I know, and somewhat impossible to answer, but I'd love to get your views on the benefits, if there are any, on spending big bucks on monitors. I truly know nothing about speakers though, so please translate the hardcore technical stuff into layman's terms 

So, in short; there are no blindingly obvious (to me) problems with my current monitoring setup. RTA tests indicate an unusually flat frequency response at the listening position (especially with ARC). In light of this, do I have anything substantial to gain from upgrading to 'pro' monitors?


Sorry to be one of those who posts an almost unanswerable question, but I still think I can learn from whatever discussion might follow!

If you've had those speakers for a long time, and they're doing the job, I say keep them. You've got a lot of hours invested in training your ears to them; an upgrade might actually incur a temporary setback as you're forced to start the training process all over again.

If you're dying to blow some cash, consider a pair of nice hi-fi speakers to use as an alternate reference.

Lol, thanks Bit - I'm certainly not dying to burn some cash!! But yeah, that's currently what I'm thinking - why mess with what works? I'm just curious to know if I'm missing out on anything amazing by not having 'better' monitors, whatever that means...

I'm no pro. Take everything I say with a grain of salt ;) Merely a hobbyist having a ramble.

I have the HS80m's also and was even considering getting that KRK sub. Do you like the sub addition by the way? I was more thinking of getting it for listening purposes than mixing as I thought it would be fun.
Back on track. The HS80m monitors seem to be pretty well regarded in the price range. I have had a listen to some higher end monitors and I believe I could hear into the mix much more than I could with the Yams. If you feel that your monitors are currently the weakest link in your chain, then upgrading is certainly going to be a good move, provided you want something to spend money on. It's a priority thing here. Maybe a nice new acoustic guitar or some acoustic absorption/trapping/diffusion work will give you more bang for your buck. But that's up to you.

The thing you should find with better monitors I think is that you can just hear more detail. The whole balance thing about having a really 'flat' set of monitors I think is slightly a bit silly. A typical well treated room is still going to fluctuate more than different well designed monitors (remember that grain of salt you were taking).

Not really much more I can add other than my interpretation of a few other monitors I have listened to when I was buying my Yams. I listened to the KRK VXT4's and I really liked them. I felt I could hear more detail in the music which would make eq, reverb and compressor settings that much easier to adjust. Also LOVED the sound of the Adams - specifically the A7's. If you want high end detail, these are amazing for that. Comparing them to any other monitor I have listened to, they sound clear and bright, but other monitors sound like white noise in comparison.

I'll have to pop down to a store and have a listen to some new monitors again now that I have had the Yams for a good few years and and used to the sound they put out. When I has A/B ing them I was mixing only on crappy hi fi speakers so I imagine my ears should be much more attuned to the sound of good monitors now.



The all important question though, what's your budget?

Good point from Bit there about already having learnt them. I wouldn't personally bother upgrading from the Yams until I was spending a really decent amount of cash on them, like a set of $3000-5000 monitors (which is just a couple of years off!!!!). If you're going to upgrade from something that's already good, might as well make it a significant upgrade. Otherwise, buy my mics :)

Thanks Matt - I wish I could go to a store with a selection of quality monitors to listen to - there are no real pro audio shops in Perth - the HS80s are about as high end as they get! But yeah totally agree, if I were to upgrade, I'd be looking to spend between $5k - $7k. But I have no budget for it right now, just wondering if it's something I need to be saving for...

Hi James,

Personally, I think what you have is good enough. I remember you mentioned you were using ARC and were happy with the results you were getting in your mixes. That said, different monitors *might* give you a different perspective and may imrpove things....or you may end up like me and it may not make a difference.

On all my monitors here and in the other studio, I don't notice that I mix better on one pair than another. I get about the same results to where I don't have to use a certain pair. I'm partial to my A7's because I have grown to trust them. But when I do switch through and mix or master on others, and then flip back to the Adam's...everything still sounds the way it should.

When we do your project (if that's still a go) I'll tell you what I hear on your stuff. If there are blatant problem areas, we'll address them and see if it's a monitor issue or maybe something you just need to be taught to listen for that you may be missing. I'd say don't do anything yet brother. Or, share some songs on the songs forum or privately to a few trusted sources. Let them tell you what they hear and go from there.

The only thing I may be a bit concerned with is that sub 10. I have the same one in my new studio and had to dial it down quite a bit. I much prefer the Adam sub 8 as it seems to have a tighter low end where the KRK 10 is a bit more flabby. But again, turning it down a bit totally fixed it for me as I was mixing a little bass light with it where it was initially. You know you can always bounce a mix off me if you need me to check anything out. Definitely consider that before you spend the money.

I've not had a chance to work with those new Yamaha's yet...but I have the old NS-10's here and to me, now that they've been ARC'd and have a sub, they are just as good as my Adam's and when I toggle, there is no difference in sound other than the NS-10's have their own flavor or character so to speak. But my mixes sound just as good in them as anything else without any blatant errors. Hope this helps. :)

-Danny

Thanks Danny, that's pretty much what I was thinking, but wanted to make sure! And don't worry, I won't be buying anything - no budget for anything right now!

And yep, still going to send you my project to master, just need to find time to finish it off. Got everything recorded apart from vocals - have been awaiting for my voice to recover after a pretty bout with pneumonia. 

Great, so the consensus seems to be that I don't need to upgrade - very good news! I'll be very interested to hear what you reckon about the mixes I send to you, Danny - I think they're sounding killer, so if they suck, either there's a big problem with my monitoring environment, or I'm a total wood-duck!

Yep, just treat yourself with some nice new mics ;)

I agree with the idea that your monitors are probably very useful as it is.

With regards to your question; It seems like it is useful to consider that, in 2012, the term "monitor" is more likely to mean "powered monitor" than "passive monitor".

My point being that speaker design and construction is fairly well established and furthermore modern construction practices have created the circumstances where very good speaker drivers and cabinet systems are easier to get than ever and probably, if inflation is considered, cheaper than ever as well.

The place where most affordable powered monitors fall short is in the actual power amp system.

If you want great transient response you need a great amplifier. If you want a great amplifier you need a great power supply. If you want a great power supply, you can get one for a traditional rack mount amplifier, or you can get two for a pair of self powered speakers.

I'd suggest that many popularly priced monitors that seem semi pro have really good speakers and good enclosure designs, but most have a power supply and an amplifier that can easily be demonstrated to have a less than deluxe a sound than can be had with the really good guts and parts.

All of this stuff I am speaking of is happening well below the fairy dust threshold and is just basic budget stuff until you get to about $1.5k per box.


That's why some popular 8" speakers have ratings like this:

Max Peak SPL:109 dB (what distance???)

Amplifier Class:Class A-B

Power Output:90W

High Frequency:20W

Mid-Frequency:N/A

Low Frequency:70W

and other *professional* 8" speakers have ratings like this:

   Maximum SPL (80 Hz - 20 kHz):>108 dB SPL / 1m
   Maximum Peak SPL (80 Hz - 20 kHz):>111 dB SPL / 1m

   Low Frequency: Sine Wave Power Rating:250 watts (<0.1% THD into rated impedance)

   High Frequency: Sine Wave Power Rating:120 watts (<0.1% THD into rated impedance)



 There is a lot more head room, which usually translates to smooth and powerful transient response, in the second example, especially if they are really rated at the same actual SPL output (which I doubt is really the case even though it has been implied by the omission of distance info in example 1)

 In this particular example, you can assume that the tweeter is also rated at a much higher power output and so it should be able to handle any transients with more ease and less distortion or aggressiveness.

 The nicer amplifier system will provide a crisper and more powerful impression of the kick drum and it will also provide a nicer representation of aggressive upper mid tones... even on less than nice speaker drivers.

 

 Best regards,
mike