I just installed a new shaper, and I'm wondering about application. I know they are really good on drums and bass to add punch? I'm wondering about applying on tracks/buses and or the mains?
 
I'm afraid the answer is, "it depends" and try it and see how it sounds... I'm just wondering if there are rules-of-thumb? Because I've never really used a TS before. (I got TransX)
 
And where does it go in the chain? i.e., I know the limiter goes last. What if you're using a compressor? Does the TS go before, or after the compressor?
 
Any advice is appreciated.
 
Thanks.

How I see it is that transient shaping traditionally has it most obvious use on percussive sounds where it's just a matter of controlling the attack and decay elements of those kinds of sounds.

I understand that the emergence of things like TransX give more opportunities of controlling the detail of transients against the background of resonance, so are as effective on bringing out detail on sub-mixed material even as they are on more strictly transient material such as drums alone.

Obviously it is going to have little or no effect on things like strings, pads and organs but will give control over anything that has definite transient qualities, such as knocking back the percussiveness of a piano or bringing out the brightness of chord strums on a guitar for example.

So it's really a case of try and decide to start with until you get familiar with the situations where it will be a help.  A good TS is certainly a great tool to have around and looking at the reviews that TransX gets it sounds like it is better than most.

So rather than a compressor which is bringing energy into the control of a specific range a TS is sharpening or blurring the focus of the detail if you like.

I've had some positive experiences using TS on acoustic guitar strumming.

Jonbouy


How I see it is that transient shaping traditionally has it most obvious use on percussive sounds where it's just a matter of controlling the attack and decay elements of those kinds of sounds.

I understand that the emergence of things like TransX give more opportunities of controlling the detail of transients against the background of resonance, so are as effective on bringing out detail on sub-mixed material even as they are on more strictly transient material such as drums alone.

Obviously it is going to have little or no effect on things like strings, pads and organs but will give control over anything that has definite transient qualities, such as knocking back the percussiveness of a piano or bringing out the brightness of chord strums on a guitar for example.

So it's really a case of try and decide to start with until you get familiar with the situations where it will be a help.  A good TS is certainly a great tool to have around and looking at the reviews that TransX gets it sounds like it is better than most.

So rather than a compressor which is bringing energy into the control of a specific range a TS is sharpening or blurring the focus of the detail if you like.

Well said my brother.  
 
-Danny

Transient shaping can certainly tighten up a sound that might have a slight sloppy leading edge or start transient. But they are also great in the reverse situation as well. I had a snare that was recorded and tuned and everything too thin. It had a massive transient and not much energy. It made quite an unpleasant clicky type and very thin snare sound. It was loud but did not sound right.

Some transient shaping just softened the edge enough for the sound to get much fatter and hence not so high as well transient wise. I was able to boost up the rms level quite a bit making the snare fatter, louder and bigger sounding.

On the acoustic guitar there are two ways I think now to soften over fast and clicky transients. You can still use a compressor the right way to jump on the attack transient of a sound but a transient shaper is a newer thing and hence more complex in terms of what it does. It seems to work well.

Sound on Sound wrote some very good articles explaining the transient shaper inside Sonar a while back. There are quite a few controls and they all effect how it sounds while it is transient shaping.

I tend to use them on tracks but not sure about busses. If a buss contained a lot of similar types of transient sounds then it could work. I am not sure how it would handle a multitude of different sounds eg a mix or a buss that has many things on it. I think it is always a good attitute to have that all these things while they might do something good in one way, they might be degrading the signal in another way and maybe leave them off is the right answer if in doubt. But they can certainly save a track too.

I've had a fair bit of success with Sonar's Transient tool, notably on Tom tracks, though I've never used it on a buss for the very reasons you're talking about Jeff.

Danny, I think maybe the reason we differ in our appreciation of the TS64 is one of intended use.

You mentioned that you use it for "allowing instruments to be more percussive" [attack] and "strings that you wanted to resonate a little longer" [sustain]

My usage has been at the opposite end of the spectrum where I've wanted to dull leading Transients, or to reign in eg. a ringing Tom.

For this type of work I've found the TS64 to be really useful, does what it says on the tin and is quite tweakable.

Bristol_Jonesey


I've had a fair bit of success with Sonar's Transient tool, notably on Tom tracks, though I've never used it on a buss for the very reasons you're talking about Jeff.

Danny, I think maybe the reason we differ in our appreciation of the TS64 is one of intended use.

You mentioned that you use it for "allowing instruments to be more percussive" [attack] and "strings that you wanted to resonate a little longer" [sustain]

My usage has been at the opposite end of the spectrum where I've wanted to dull leading Transients, or to reign in eg. a ringing Tom.

For this type of work I've found the TS64 to be really useful, does what it says on the tin and is quite tweakable.

Oh yeah, make no mistake Jonesey...the Sonar version works...I'm just saying, when you compare it to the SPL, the Sonar version doesn't sound like that. I can make the SPL sound sort of like the Sonar version. Yeah the sustain thing also can remove ring/sustain as well. It's an amazing little tool. I would have loved to see the Sonar version be as potent as the SPL as the sonar version DOES give you a few other cool things that no one else has. I just seem to have an easier time getting whatever I need from the SPL without needing any of the extra bells and whistles. :) I'm with you though...it definitely curbs and controls transients quite well. :)
 
-Danny

Bando_

I've had atrocious results with every transient shaping tool I could get my hands on (Waves, Alloy, Sonar, etc.) ... after much toying.

At this point I save transient shaping for buss or mastering:

PSP Zenon (which I've never tried) ... and the Slate FG-X Limiter are both about $250 street.  These take much of the mystery out of transient shaping ... but they are mastering tools with CPU overloads.

(Steven Slate sells both excellent drum samples and his fg-x limiter) (though his gay ads are bit quirky, IMHO)

Last night I 'corrected' some vital transients using the Slate fg-x transient knobs ... very easy, intuitive, and idiot-proof ... which I love.

IMHO, transients are like moody fads though.  One day you/I like timbre, the next day you like transients.

In sum, I pretty much save all transient worries for the mastering level.  Often my ME (---^) can take care of that.  :):):)

I was at the Quick Trip today and when leaving saw a guy with a sign begging money at the light? And I encouraged him to do some jumping jacks? "Transiant Shaping?"

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