How many of you folks use this technique in your mixes?  I absolutely love the effect it provides for vocals.  Unfortunately, anyone who happens to play the mix in Mono (smart phone, laptop speaker, some public venues...) will get no vocals.  I found this out the hard way when I circulated an MP3 and more than one person replied back with "no vocals??"
 
Do you still take this risk even though you have no control over where your mix gets played?
 
Is there a similar alternative that doesn't result in a Mono washout?  I've tried this track clone technique without phase inversion, and it loses some of its magic it seems.
 
Thanks
wicker1000

hate duplicated cloned vox tracks.

much more, prefer to actually sing the vocals twice.

i lay these right on top of each other.

then for backups, i sing each part twice, and pan them the same.
works great for 3-part harmonies, so that would be 8 vocal tracks in all.

this is the way that Rundgren did a lot of his vox's, it's really old school, but to my ears, sounds so much better than cloned tracks that have digital tricks on them.

There is no way I would take this type of a chance with the phase invert! Mixes should be able to stand on their own in every situation. The potential for any part (let alone the vocal) to completely disappear would be unacceptable in my opinion. 

I would recommend you use Batsbrew's advice and record the part twice (rather than cloning) but even then - don't invert the phase.

If you are panning the "parent" and cloned tracks hard L and R (and inverting the phase of the cloned track) ... yes, in mono you will have no vocal.  It is called the "Out Of Speakers Trick" and is explained on page 174 of Roey Izhaki's "Mixing Audio" and I quote from his book:

"The out of speaker trick is used as a special effect, a sonic gimmick, and is usually applied on the least important instruments, or ones that appear for a very short time in the mix."

Alternatively, you can apply the Haas trick discussed on page 169 of the same book.  Pan the two tracks hard left and right then nudge the cloned track so it is from 1 to 35 milliseconds delayed (do not invert the phase). 

Best option is to double track vocals.
 
EDIT: oops, change microseconds to milliseconds

Be sure to put a sticker on your album that says "WARNING: You must listen to this with headphones." 

Or one that says "free karaoke version included!". Just play it in mono and the vocal will be gone.

Yeah not a fan of that technique. When you're starting out and first 'discover' it, it seems like the perfect amazing studio trick. But as you learn to understand these tricks better, you'll find you use them less and less. It may have it's place as referenced above from Roey Izhaki's book, but that's about it. In short, don't use it unless you really know what you're doing. Or willing to experiment.

Recording the vocal twice and panning hard right and left (as mentioned above also) provides a similar sound but without the same issues. Give that a go. Also recording vocals using the mid-side technique (abbreviated M/S) can give a similarish sort of feel again. But you may not have access to the mics available for this type of recording.


Highly recommend you check out Roey Izhaki's 'Mixing Audio' book. It's a great read and there is lots to learn from it from beginner up to advanced (though I see it as primarily a beginner to intermediate book). The section on compressors is particularly good.

Hey thanks guys.  Guess I'll steer clear for obvious reasons.  I've recorded and mixed a soprano doing "Amazing Grace" and the effect is stunning when she does her classically trained vibrato thingy - but no good in mono.  No possibility for double take as she's an out of towner, so it's one-and-done. 
 
I did just pick up a copy of Roey's book - look forward to reading and learning.  I'm a total newb at this stuff, so it's all ground breaking for me.
 
wicker1000

You could just put the vocal track dead center than put in reverbs or delays that would travel in your desired width so that i could also be suitable in mono and not only stereo.

A voice like that doesn't NEED to be doubled/thickened. You'll ruin it.

Severed's got the right idea, Reverb or Delay or both.

If you want to get a bit more creative, use Channel Tools on the Reverb bus and play around with the width settings.

I don't like cloned tracks.

I prefer to record at least 3 "keeper" vocal tracks. Use the best one for the lead..... centered and up front. 

Pan the others and keep them low.... -18db to -24 db usually works well.  You get the hint of the vocal doubling in stereo but not overpowering. 

I have even used 5 tracks... one centered and two right and two left at different pannings.... a bit fatter but keep them low.