• Hardware
  • Acoustic guitar pickup question and Cloudlifter preamp question. Fethead...
2014/08/10 18:55:47
jbow
I have an old Takamine. A G330 (lawsuit model). I have an old "in the hole" pickup, DiMarzio I think. I never use it. I am thinking about getting a good pickup put in it, I don't care if there has to be a hole cut in the bout for the EQ and whatever other controls.
So... my question is this. Does anyone have a recommendation for a good pickup system?
 
Other question. I am thinking about buying a Cloudlifter preamp for ribbon and dynamic mics (SM7b primarily). I am thinking about going ahead and getting the one with two preamps but there is another one the "Z" that offers more control. Is anyone using one of these? Any thoughts on which one to get?
Links. http://cloudmicrophones.com/cloud12/?page_id=227 or http://cloudmicrophones.com/cloud12/?page_id=217 maybe http://cloudmicrophones.com/cloud12/?page_id=222 
 
edit> you know what. I got forgot about the Fethead. It was what I was originally looking at for helping ribbon microphones. It is cheaper too. http://www.economik.com/triton-audio/fethead/
 
Thanks,
Julien
2014/08/11 08:53:35
fireberd
Fishman is the most often used in (factory) guitars, and most of what is for sale separately.  My wife has a Takamine and a new Martin and both have Fishman electronics with under the bridge pickups.
 
Keep an eye on the Musician's Friend site and their stupid deal of the day.  Occasionally they have will have one of their own brand name "Rogue" guitars on sale with a Fishman pickup for less than you can buy a Fishman pickup system.   The Rogue guitars are cheap and crap but the Fishman electronics can be installed in another guitar.   I did that about a year ago with an $89 stupid deal of the day - installed the electronics in a friends guitar and we trashed the guitar.
2014/08/11 11:07:05
jbow
Keep an eye on the Musician's Friend site and their stupid deal of the day.  Occasionally they have will have one of their own brand name "Rogue" guitars on sale with a Fishman pickup for less than you can buy a Fishman pickup system.   The Rogue guitars are cheap and crap but the Fishman electronics can be installed in another guitar.   I did that about a year ago with an $89 stupid deal of the day - installed the electronics in a friends guitar and we trashed the guitar.
 
Wow, thanks Fireberd! What a great tip! I'll do just that.
 
Julien
2014/08/11 11:58:59
AT
The Cloudlifter works the few times I've used it.  A better (and more expensive!) answer is a good preamp.  The Warm Audio WA12 or Focusrite ISA One (about $400) will supply enough gain for ribbons or SMb 7.  And dynamics respond really well to a good preamp.  We were fooling around w/ a Telefunken M-80 on different preamps and you could plainly hear the preamp.  Much more than with most condensers.  It is a lot of money, but you can use them until you are 64, and past.  If you think of it as a long-term investment, it is easier to swallow.  And your condensers will love it, too.
@
2014/08/11 19:19:08
jbow
Well, if I can use it for a year and a half I guess it is a good deal!
 
The reason I was looking at the Cloudlifter was originally to boost a ribbon mic while protecting it from phantom power. I'll probably go with the 149.00 single channel model. Use it with an Octa-Capture, keep the OC pres a little lower. If I really like it I may spring for the "Z", not sure. Everything I read about the Cloudlifter sounds interesting to me. I'm happy to hear that it does work.
Thanks,
J
2014/08/11 19:41:22
mettelus
Re: the pickup... I have an old Dean Markley PRO-MAG "in the hole" pickup that I do use off and on. The advantage is it is further from the bridge than and "under saddle" bridge pickup, so doesn't pick up excessive high harmonics (creates a very high timbre) and is electric, so won't pick up environment noise like a microphone can.
 
I would personally not cut any holes into the face, as much of the tension to support the bridge is "engineered" into that face. If you can pull the saddle out with the strings off (it may be glued in), then an "under saddle" bridge pickup could be installed (it would require 2 holes drilled... one small one under the saddle on one end, and another for an instrument jack on the body). Can google "under saddle bridge pickup" to see what one looks like.
 
If you have never tried the "in the hole" pickup you own, it may be worth giving it a run. I personally am not a big fan of the bridge pickup, although my acoustic has one.
 
Edit: I found reference that the 330s is a solid top, and the 330 is laminate. A laminate top is definitely something I would never cut.
2014/08/12 00:32:54
MacFurse
Not a fan of soundhole pickups at all. I've yet to hear one that doesn't lose all 'acoustic' character, all sounding very middy, very 'electrified'. 
 
I've installed many bridge piezo pickups. (owned a music shop). Mettelus is talking about not cutting the face, which you never would, but the eq's mount usually on the top edge, and I'm a fan of replacing the strap end pin with a jack/strap pin combo. Fitting the piezo strip is not an easy thing to do as the saddle slot usually needs shaping and perfect routing, otherwise the piezo strip will not seat correctly, and you get a variance in tone/volume from individual strings. Cutting the hole for the eq, and drilling the whole for the jack, are best left to someone with the right tools and some experience. It's very easy to tear the wood. If you go down the route of a piezo pickup, take it to someone who does these things on a regular basis, or to someone recommended. Believe me, it can go horribily wrong.
 
I find piezo bridge pickups the best for recording, and for playing live.
 
But having said that, for tracking, I only mic up my acoustic's. Can't beat that sound when done right.
 
All the best with it.
2014/08/13 10:03:14
mettelus
MacFurse
But having said that, for tracking, I only mic up my acoustic's. Can't beat that sound when done right.



Very nice post! Thank you for the clarification (I actually prefer a mic when tracking as well).
 
In all seriousness, for the "cost" of doing this work, you could pick up another guitar. I had an Ovation that split on the (solid) face (after 25 years), and went to a Guitar Center (wanting a acoustic/electric cutaway), and bought a Fender 140SCE which sounds very nice (I think was on sale for like $220). This already has all of the things mentioned in the OP, and sounds beautiful.
 
Stupid aside - I played a LOT of guitars that day, and asked the rep why the one I bought had nicer sound than ones significantly more expensive. His reply was, "The assembly/gluing of each is unique, so each one will have a different sound to them." I personally would never buy a guitar online for this same reason... you need to play it to hear it... in fact, the best sounding guitar was even cheaper (but no pickup or cutaway), so I went with the one I bought.
2014/08/13 14:12:55
AT
Best point of the entire thread, Mettelus.
 
@
2014/08/13 14:37:07
sock monkey
I agree that installing an under the saddle PU is a very tricky business. You can do some serious damage and loose the original tone of the guitar too! 
I also find that a under the saddle PU system most times will be uneven output from each string. 
 
Go into any music shop and using an acoustic amp and a set of headphones audition ANY acoustic electric,, slowly one by one listen to the volume of each string. 
 
The best I've used for even sound was the LR Baggs with the solid brass bottom that Seagulls used to use. They now use the common ribbon type and they suck now too. 
 
So I have become a fan of using a mike again. 
I use the Saddle PU for rhythm and the mike for leads and fills when playing live.
And don't toss out the old Dean Markley, Those were good PU's.
My son just bought a sound hole PU system and it sounds great,,, I think it's called Gold Tone?? 
 
 
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