• SONAR
  • Sonar X3 Studio and Melodyne (p.2)
2014/05/27 21:52:29
rbowser
Sanderxpander
I don't like working destructively on my audio unless resource management makes it necessary...



I certainly wouldn't want to go back to when I had my first computer, and had to destructively add reverb to my tracks, and other FX like that which we want to use in real time, leaving the original track dry and original.  But If there's a clam note from an instrument or vocal that was intended to be on pitch, I don't see any point in keeping and archiving an uncorrected audio clip.  Fixing an error like an off-pitch in a clip is in a very different category from destructively adding FX.
 
Randy
2014/05/28 05:59:46
paulo
Are you using a registered version of Melodyne or are you using it in 30 day trial period ? I only ask because the trial version requires www connection each time you use it. Just trying to think of why your edits are going awol, not had that probem at all here.
 
As for the keep original debate, I tend to copy the track first, mute/hide the original and work on the copy. I hear what people are saying re keeping stuff that is "wrong", but I prefer not to leave loads of open clips, yet sometimes need to edit the edits which in some cases seems to work better starting over than trying to re-edit an edit. Once I'm totally happy with the project, it's easy enough to delete the audio tracks that are no longer required and a 'save as'  tidies up the audio folder at the end.
 
 
 
 
2014/05/28 08:49:44
Sanderxpander
rbowser
Sanderxpander
I don't like working destructively on my audio unless resource management makes it necessary...



I certainly wouldn't want to go back to when I had my first computer, and had to destructively add reverb to my tracks, and other FX like that which we want to use in real time, leaving the original track dry and original.  But If there's a clam note from an instrument or vocal that was intended to be on pitch, I don't see any point in keeping and archiving an uncorrected audio clip.  Fixing an error like an off-pitch in a clip is in a very different category from destructively adding FX.
 
Randy

I disagree, I don't see why pitch correction plugins should get special status. You keep your compressor and EQ active for the same reason - it basically fixes a "problem" but you're not sure you've got it set perfectly yet. You may need to adjust it more after the other instruments are added. I will often Melodyne the worst few notes after an initial listen, to see if the take can work at all. Later on I'll be more meticulous. I could bounce near mixdown time I suppose but I've never really needed to yet.

Any advertised function should work, period. The rest is work-arounds and goodwill from the user.
2014/05/28 09:08:20
Kalle Rantaaho
Sanderxpander

Any advertised function should work, period. The rest is work-arounds and goodwill from the user.
Regardless, if a function is advertised as working, I don't see why it should get special status just because it i



Should, yes. And expecting all advertised functions to work in every project and every set up is 100% unrealistic, not to mention relying on it.
If a simple thing like fast bounce can put a respected, pro quality VST to its knees, it's obvious that extremely complicated and deep VSTs can mess up whole projects if you don't treat them like opera divas. 
I'm sometimes amazed reading of guys doing complicated edits on the fly when project is playing back, and then getting annoyed when the whole program stalls.  If a program promises you the Moon, many start using it as if Mars was mentioned.
 
2014/05/28 10:07:27
Sanderxpander
You wouldn't expect to have to stop the program to adjust an EQ either. I'm all for being reasonable towards the developer and I'm fine using work-arounds to avoid crashes. I'm just saying I don't see why pitch correction should be awarded special leniency. If it's not stable when running multiple clips, don't let us.
2014/05/28 10:22:22
rbowser
Sanderxpander...Any advertised function should work, period...
...I disagree...etc.


Hi, Sanderxpander - I do sympathize with what you're saying about expecting something to work as advertised.  I just wanted to explain that I'm not getting crashes due to pitch shifting, because I work in a way that makes fewer demands on my computer.  I want to get on with the work!--not deal with crashes I can easily avoid.  

I don't feel I'm giving Melodyne "special leniency."  What seems illogical to me is to Not bounce.  Permanently fixing something which wasn't intended in a track, a clam note, isn't a "work around - IMHO - Bouncing to clip to fix the clam is the only method that makes sense to me.  I want to be sure there isn't any DC Offset in a track too, but I wouldn't want to run some plugin that temporarily fixes it on the fly - I want to run the DC Offset filter and permanently fix that track.

Kalle Rantaaho...If a program promises you the Moon, many start using it as if Mars was mentioned.


That cracked me up - Very clever statement of something that's very true.

I hadn't looked at Celemony's online tips and tricks kind of pages about Melodyne.  Now that I have, I see they advise bouncing to clips to save Ram.  Saving Ram is always a good idea to avoid the "I expected Mars" syndrome.  

On their site, they're also still saying you should temporarily set your buffer to a much larger size than usual, 1024 samples - and then re-set again when through with Melodyne.  When engaging Melodyne, I think we all used to see that pop-up with the "your buffer is too small" message.  Melodyne still works with a more normal, smaller buffer, - but the warning is still there, ready to be referred to if we start experiencing problems when trying to run it the way we run real time effects.

All of that is IMHO - You can have a different opinion, but you can't say my method of working, based on my analysis of the situation, is "wrong."  It's hard to argue with the efficiency of how I work, but obviously there are other ways of working, including ways that can apparently cause crashes.

I don't disagree with you, Sanderxpander, and I don't think how you're working is "wrong."  I'm just letting you know what my attitude is towards the whole pitch shift question.  When it comes to fixing pitches here and there, the process is pretty stress free for me!

Randy
2014/05/28 13:49:37
Sanderxpander
I agree and I don't really run into problems not bouncing. I just feel that sometimes it almost comes off as accusing a user of causing the crashes by not bouncing each and every instance, and I don't think that's fair.
2014/05/28 14:58:14
simpleman
 
When an application edits, this action is being held in a temp file-cache file etc. When you close Sonar that 'file' is not being kept or the pointer to it is being dissolved.
As mentioned; you increase the size of that file "buffer". Also are you running as 'Administrator'
2014/06/01 17:01:29
Splat
> I disagree, I don't see why pitch correction plugins should get special status. You keep your compressor and EQ active for the same reason - it basically fixes a "problem" but you're not sure you've got it set perfectly yet. 
 
Not all plugins are the same. Some plugins that "look ahead" to analyse what is coming up often requires more power and more RAM, and the algorithms and logic used is far more complex.
 
Regardless this is what I do everytime I used melodyne.
1) Bounce to another track.
2) On the bounced track I do my melodyne edits.
3) Then I bounce the treated Melodyne track to a new track and I call that the master.
4) I archive off the other tracks just in case.

It's the safest way. Software is never perfect and you need to accommodate for this. I find this procedure no different then say backing up Windows periodically in case something goes wrong or saving your Sonar project periodically. Or having a cup of tea.

I don't run as Administrator and I have no issues. I really don't think Sonar should be run "as administrator" nowadays other than to get over issues such as not being able to register the product or to run a plugin that absolutely insists on it.
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