Personally, I don't think it's unreasonable to be able to do something you could do in a previous version that isn't a major redesign.

And even with a major redesign, I don't think that having to click a microscopic button to expose additional sends is a pain.  Once again a time wasting operation.  I use sends to create additional headphone mixes.  Having to scroll around takes time and I've grabbed the wrong send because one channel was scrolled and the next one wasn't.
 

Respect, zentatonic. I'm done.
 
I wasn't trying to drive it too far. I thought the gripe deserved to be heard. That's all.
 
Cake's position is clear and it was never a big deal.

I have to side with CJay on this. I opened up X-2 and X-3 and opened 24 track project templates and the scrolling in X-2 is Way better and way more efficient. It scrolls exactly 1 track at a time no matter if they are all collapsed or just some it still scrolls 1 track at a time all the way to the last track which stops at the top. X-3 is just messed up! Why would you change something like this? I was scrolling with the mouse wheel. I never scroll any other way.

I could be wrong but I suspect a lot of this was down to developing the new touch screen functionality and the different way of working.
Developers are having a very hard time lately, Windows 8.1 has brought back the start button after much peer pressure and now Apple is feeling the wrath....
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/10/28/apples_massive_software_update_fail/
 

Jlien X

gswitz
In this case, I cannot scroll the track I'm soloing to the place where I have available real-estate.
 

 
You know what he's talking about.
 
So do I. I don't think that limiting us to scrolling within 1/2 the pane gives us enough credit as users.
 
Just my opinion. I'm not all worked up about it. Obviously CJ is seriously irritated (he isn't always, you know).
 
 

 
Very good example. Ctrl+Shift+H may still work, but scrolling down would be easier.

 
Ditto, now I understand.  
 
However... if it was me, I would just move a plugin out of the way if I needed to better see that track.   Or, maybe use Auto-Zoom.   Or set up a screen set. 
 

CJaysMusic
Well that Freaking SUCKS! Why cant you scroll to see one particular track, if there is enough real estate to see it!??!? I mean there is enough track space to see it. You could do this in all the other versions.
 
So the intended way for this to work is not logical. We already established, there is enough space.. Is that because Cake gave them a certain amount of time to write this screwy code?

 
I'm not sure what other applications let you scroll your data list when there's ample space to display all data? I know the newer behavior hinders your existing workflow, but your accusation that fractional scrolling is an indicator that SONAR's code is screwy, illogical, or just a development time waste is really off base.
 
The primary 'Why' of this change was to facilitate better lane/comp management and editing within them. In the past 'all' of your working data could potentially go off screen with a single click of the mouse-wheel. Especially when you needed to see another lane/take or an adjacent track and where at particular zoom levels.

Dude Ivey
I have to side with CJay on this. I opened up X-2 and X-3 and opened 24 track project templates and the scrolling in X-2 is Way better and way more efficient. It scrolls exactly 1 track at a time no matter if they are all collapsed or just some it still scrolls 1 track at a time all the way to the last track which stops at the top. X-3 is just messed up! Why would you change something like this? I was scrolling with the mouse wheel. I never scroll any other way.

When you introduce lanes this scrolling behavior becomes less efficient as your work space can easily be ripped away from you and the overall UI becomes jumpy and unpleasing. Fractional scrolling is something we've wanted to do for a long time. I had heard about it before we ever had touch support.
 
On my system, 24 tracks can be scrolled through with less than 1 full revolution of the mouse wheel with only 2 full collapsed tracks showing in the track pane. When the pane is larger or full expanded it's requires even less user input. I'm not sure how that's terribly inefficient? 
 

stevec
 Ditto, now I understand.  
 
However... if it was me, I would just move a plugin out of the way if I needed to better see that track.   Or, maybe use Auto-Zoom.   Or set up a screen set. 
 

X-Ray helps there too. Though if a user needs to look at that much data at once, they may want to up their screen resolution or expand their overall desktop with a 2nd display.

Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]

CJaysMusic
Well that Freaking SUCKS! Why cant you scroll to see one particular track, if there is enough real estate to see it!??!? I mean there is enough track space to see it. You could do this in all the other versions.
 
So the intended way for this to work is not logical. We already established, there is enough space.. Is that because Cake gave them a certain amount of time to write this screwy code?

 
I'm not sure what other applications let you scroll your data list when there's ample space to display all data? I know the newer behavior hinders your existing workflow, but your accusation that fractional scrolling is an indicator that SONAR's code is screwy, illogical, or just a development time waste is really off base.
 
The primary 'Why' of this change was to facilitate better lane/comp management and editing within them. In the past 'all' of your working data could potentially go off screen with a single click of the mouse-wheel. Especially when you needed to see another lane/take or an adjacent track and where at particular zoom levels.

Dude Ivey
I have to side with CJay on this. I opened up X-2 and X-3 and opened 24 track project templates and the scrolling in X-2 is Way better and way more efficient. It scrolls exactly 1 track at a time no matter if they are all collapsed or just some it still scrolls 1 track at a time all the way to the last track which stops at the top. X-3 is just messed up! Why would you change something like this? I was scrolling with the mouse wheel. I never scroll any other way.

When you introduce lanes this scrolling behavior becomes less efficient as your work space can easily be ripped away from you and the overall UI becomes jumpy and unpleasing. Fractional scrolling is something we've wanted to do for a long time. I had heard about it before we ever had touch support.
 
On my system, 24 tracks can be scrolled through with less than 1 full revolution of the mouse wheel with only 2 full collapsed tracks showing in the track pane. When the pane is larger or full expanded it's requires even less user input. I'm not sure how that's terribly inefficient? 
 

stevec
 Ditto, now I understand.  
 
However... if it was me, I would just move a plugin out of the way if I needed to better see that track.   Or, maybe use Auto-Zoom.   Or set up a screen set. 
 

X-Ray helps there too. Though if a user needs to look at that much data at once, they may want to up their screen resolution or expand their overall desktop with a 2nd display.

Ok, I never took lanes into account! Now I see your point too. I just tried it with just tracks. I'll try it with lanes too. As far as your mouse scrolling through 24 tracks with one revolution those settings can be changed within windows right? So it will scroll more or less with each click? Not an argument just a question. Thanks for your reply!

I have to go with Cakewalk's side of things here, I have been annoyed to no end in the past when I was working and scrolled and my carefully set up visible workspace was gone. But I wonder if it could become a setting somewhere - scroll by track or by pixel or something.

Just tried X-2 and X-3 with lanes open on a few tracks throughout the project (24 tracks) X-2 is flawless in scrolling with mouse wheel. It goes from track to track and lane to lane and track to track flawlessly. The scrolling is better in X-2 than X-3. I'm not dogging X-3 but CJay has a point. I never use X-2 anymore, I use X-3. I love X-3 and will use it until X-4. This is a very minor thing to me but the scrolling with the mouse wheel is better in X-2.

Seth, I don't have a problem with the fractional scrolling myself. You can hold down shift as Danny described. And I'm not sure, but I think CJs only real beef is with limiting him to 1/2 the available pane when what he wants is the last track at the top without having to reduce the size of the pane to accommodate it. 

I know you're trying to answer everyone. I personally think fractional scrolling is a win. It helps me.  As Danny points out, fractional scrolling in the bus pane doesn't make quite the same amount of sense, but the shift key helps there. 

A nod that you understand and can imagine how it would be helpful would do it for me. I'm not saying you have to promise to put it back. Just acknowledge the validity of the gripe... this would make us feel heard by you and Cake. 

BTW, in X2 for me, I don't scroll the last track out of the tracks pane. The last track stops neatly at the top of the pane. It is exactly this that would be a nice option.

Part of my reasoning is that I often bounce to tracks and the last track in the project becomes a 'mixdown' track. I regularly need to focus on this mixdown track alone. having it stop in the middle of the screen just isn't as useful. 

You mention X-Ray and 'get another screen'. I've got 2 screens and I'm still pushed for space. I use apps outside of Sonar like RME DigiCheck and I get bunches of instances of that application running at once. I spread them around and monitor them. So XRay isn't always a choice and even if it was, it's a bandaid.  I don't use XRay to monitor two things at once. I use it to get below and get back easily.

Thanks for listing the 'Why' but you seemed to give the 'Why' for fractional scrolling rather than the limit to 1/2 the tracks pane. That's the 'Why' I was looking for. 

Just nod and say you understand. I keep talking because you keep insisting that it is unreasonable.