+1 Remove empty lanes. Feature request.
 
Regards,

It seems to me the anti-lanes cohort is actually two (mostly) different groups.  One group hates lanes because there are bugs.  The other group hates lanes because the feature is different from layers.
 
My experience is that I use to hit the bugs and haven't hit them recently, now that I have a very consistent work flow.   Nonetheless, there are bugs and they ought to be fixed.  I don't think anybody disputes that.
 
But on the "I hate lanes because they aren't exactly like layers" is a different matter.  I never used layers, but the lanes feature seems to work very sensibly and easily.  What's the big deal here?  What doesn't work as well as layers?

Actually it's a bit of both but both lanes & layers are/ were buggy.
As I've said before removing & adding new half baked features is a 'one step forward , two steps back' mentality.
These issues have been on going for about a year now without any resolve.

I do my best to speak of my own experience with Sonar.
 
I'm not trying to play any games here, simply voicing an extended discomfort with some changes the Cakewalk company made and while I believe that if they haven't been working on it already, this thread isn't gonna get it into X3... But when decisions are made relative to the current status of the feature set as they approach the official completion/release date, it helps to mention the things that have not become acceptable with workflow change of some of their users...
 
And many who are here use Sonar in professional (business) situations where time is money and slowing a users workflow (even after a reasonable time to adjust to the latest paradigm) gets old fast for both the User and the Client!
 
Keni
 

I much prefer Take Lanes to the old layers, although I must admit it took a little time to get used to it.  I find them much easier to use (hated those teeny M and S buttons in layers).  I have had no trouble moving multiple clips within a lane or to a different lane.  I like that it is one click instead of two to open them.  I also really like the Automation lane.
 
All-in-all. I find the Take Lanes to be a workflow enhancement.  Thumbs up for me.

cparmerlee
It seems to me the anti-lanes cohort is actually two (mostly) different groups.  One group hates lanes because there are bugs.  The other group hates lanes because the feature is different from layers.
 
My experience is that I use to hit the bugs and haven't hit them recently, now that I have a very consistent work flow.   Nonetheless, there are bugs and they ought to be fixed.  I don't think anybody disputes that.
 
But on the "I hate lanes because they aren't exactly like layers" is a different matter.  I never used layers, but the lanes feature seems to work very sensibly and easily.  What's the big deal here?  What doesn't work as well as layers?

...and there at least a third group who really don't care which it is as long as I can work the way I need to... Tho I am currently managing to work this way using Lanes, it was far easier/faster and less frustrating for me than Lanes are...
 
As I mentioned previously, If they add a toggle to make Lanes appear within a track space instead of below it, change the zoom rules to be more in line with the rest of our zoom tools, and fix the blatant bugs such as not being able to copy/move data from/to Lane destinations on occasion.... I'd be fine with Lanes... I use so little of the lanes controls that the button sizes barely ever bothered me in Layers and even with the huge note space for each Lane, I doubt I've used them more than a handful of times and not typically more than a word or two written... Yet they take the lion's share of the control area and Cakewalk Freezes the zoom at 2x height...
 
Even the way it is.... If they changed the zoom situation and made the track height go to 1x when Lanes are open as well as some color change or such to make them more quickly distinguished from track controls (my eyes get lost right now) I could even live with that tho it would still feel wasteful...
 
So tho I didn't want them when they were mentioned prior to Cakewalk's implementation (found similar issues with other such softwares) and still don't, I would be a much happier camper for sure...
 
I just want to get back to working on my music without software frustration a constant nag.... 8.5.3 was already that way for me and the reasons to continue to move on from there is also due to matching with the evolving hardware/os world that is always with us...
 
I love many things we've received since X1 was released... as well as found things that I don't like and learn to live with. But that's because I never had better (for me) and I did with Sonar.... so I simply want that back....
 
Keni
 

Keni
I love many things we've received since X1 was released... as well as found things that I don't like and learn to live with. But that's because I never had better (for me) and I did with Sonar.... so I simply want that back....

This ^^^^^ absolutely Keni. I just don't understand why some folk can't grasp (or won't grasp) this extremely simple concept.
 
To these people - just imagine for a minute that there's a feature of SONAR you really like. It works perfectly the way it has for many versions and fits in with your workflow perfectly. And then it's changed, in one fell swoop, so you don't have that feature any more. And the 'new' way is more cumbersome and fiddly, and you can't work the same way or as quickly as you did with the previous feature.
 
I'll bet you would really love it when others tell you how much they like the new feature.
 
 
 
 

cparmerlee
It seems to me the anti-lanes cohort is actually two (mostly) different groups.  One group hates lanes because there are bugs.  The other group hates lanes because the feature is different from layers.
 
My experience is that I use to hit the bugs and haven't hit them recently, now that I have a very consistent work flow.   Nonetheless, there are bugs and they ought to be fixed.  I don't think anybody disputes that.
 
But on the "I hate lanes because they aren't exactly like layers" is a different matter.  I never used layers, but the lanes feature seems to work very sensibly and easily.  What's the big deal here?  What doesn't work as well as layers?

Good observation.  I, for one, was looking forward to Take Lanes when it was announced.  It was one of the features I was most excited about.  I envisioned a matured version of track layers.  Just taking what we already had and making it better.  It seemed simple enough in theory.   Layers were ok, but I always felt like there was a lot of room for improvement and when they announced Take Lanes I thought for sure this was finally it.   It never occurred to me that it could be a step back.   I was honestly shocked that it was so buggy and poorly implemented.   I'm even more shocked that it's been that way out of the gate and Cakewalk has sat by and done nothing about it. 
 
As for what doesn't work as well as layers, they definitely should have incorporated the "remove empty layers" type of feature for lanes.  Also there's the issue of the excessive amount of screen real estate lanes can take up b/c of the arbitrary lane heights.  Even though I'm not part of the "I want layers back" crowd, those are a couple of things that came to mind right away.

Silicon AudioBut, as a person that records multi-tracked acoustic drums, take lanes are my one big problem with X2.  If I could pay for an upgrade that would address this, I would drop the cash in a second. 

I agree completely. I find take lanes work ok generally for single miced takes with discrete sections and breaks,like a lead vocal. But for drums it is far too difficult to work with for the reasons already described. For the most part the issues are not bugs, just poorly implemented ideas. I find layers (while not perfect) to be much easier to work with, and after many hours of struggling with X2 I usually go back to 8.5 for tracking and editing drums in particular. I wonder if anyone who uses take lanes for drums finds them useful?

Silicon AudioBut, as a person that records multi-tracked acoustic drums, take lanes are my one big problem with X2.  If I could pay for an upgrade that would address this, I would drop the cash in a second. 

I agree completely. I find take lanes work ok generally for single miced takes with discrete sections and breaks,like a lead vocal. But for drums it is far too difficult to work with for the reasons already described. For the most part the issues are not bugs, just poorly implemented ideas. I find layers (while not perfect) to be much easier to work with, and after many hours of struggling with X2 I usually go back to 8.5 for tracking and editing drums in particular. I wonder if anyone who uses take lanes for drums finds them useful?