• SONAR
  • Best way to hook up mic/guitar?
2014/03/01 15:00:56
seed
OK so I have this soundcard:
http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Delta1010LT.html
 
and also one of these:
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/Q502USB.aspx
 
What is the ideal method for me to record mic or guitar?
 
I'm struggling to grasp all this info about signal types etc.
 
thanks as always
2014/03/04 10:36:57
seed
ugh the more i read about this the more my head just goes in circles
 
to the degree that even though my axiom 61 is hooked up via USB and seems to work fine i'm wondering if i should more appropriately have it hooked up via the midi connection to my soundcard?
 
 
weird thing is that i read about all of these inputs my soundcard has....but it seems that nobody ever recommeds plugging ANYthing directly into it?  like there is always some type of interface?
 
 
i'm totally lost :(
 
 
2014/03/06 10:03:47
seed
and last but perhaps not least
i also have a fender amp with a "line out" and "preamp out"
 
 
 
 
if this question is too petty for your time but you could supply a link that could give me a better understanding that would be greatly appreciated
 
thanks as always :)
2014/03/06 10:25:39
Cactus Music
For us to answer
with any accuracy we have to look up you sound card and read the manual or the product specs first. 
Have you read the manual for the delta? it explains it all this.
if the explanation is hard for you to understand then you might want to buy a basic audio engineering handbook. without owning your card I cannot say which is the right or wrong way to connect things, your owners manual will explain. 
2014/03/06 10:38:25
seed
ok thanks cactus i should have made this easier for yall in the first place
 
http://www.behringer.com/assets/Q502USB ... QSG_WW.pdf
 
http://www.m-audio.com/images/global/manuals/Delta1010LT-Manual.pdf
 
sadly i've read through this stuff and a ton more and just find myself spinning in circles
like you say, my general understanding of these signals is not sufficient
i promise you i'm working on it every day.  for whatever reason i'm just slow to absorb even though this is something that interests me so much!
 
if anyone can take a few minutes to look over what i have i would really appreciate it.
thanks for reading  :)
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
2014/03/06 13:11:22
spacealf
You have the balanced XLR Connector usually used for low impedence or a microphone. Impedence may not matter much anymore. You have a guitar and either you have a high-impedence input specially for guitar or you do not. They do not look like high impedence inputs on the Delta so what you have is what is left - line level inputs. So on your guitar amp you have pre-amp out or line out which is that input, but first you need connectors that plug into the Delta. Unfortunately they are phono RCA type connections and used more for stereo amp setups or consumer setups. But you can always get an adaptor to use a guitar cord (1/4" ends like a guitar cord) and plug into the phono connector with the adaptor. The three big connector is the XLR type connector and says it is for microphone. Some equipment has XLR connections (my fender new amp does) so I could use that connector because being that type of line level usually low impedence input that is what it is made for on the amp and on your Delta. The line out on your guitar amp (usually 1/4" like a guitar cord) is line level input for the phono plugs but an adaptor is needed to hook it all up together. Usually on the newer guitar amps they even have a headphone output that can be used to hook up the amp and get the simulated guitar amp cabinet sound out of it also which also would be for the phono inputs with an adaptor. (1/4" female to phono RCA type input like a stereo speaker amp receiver or amp - regular ol' consumer stereo amp with passive speakers).
 
Because of all of that, people tend to get an audio/interface that has better connections instead of using adaptors.
I use one on my normal stereo passive speaker stereo amp because I use an adaptor and it works fine. If I had powered monitor speakers that have either the XLR connector or the guitar type cord (but balanced) type connector I would use those inputs. So I have an XLR connector cord on one end and a regular 1/4" jack on the other end (except it is balanced which means it has a tip and a sleeve like a regular guitar cord but also another hot lead part between the tip and the sleeve (which is seen like a 1/4" headphone cord but instead of being L and R channel it is just a one channel balanced cord used usually in professional studio setups).
 
So except for the phono adaptors you would need, then all of that would work, and between the two units you probably have line out on the one and phono adaptor (RCA phono plug) on the Delta. Again adaptors can be used, and will work, but people get tired of using adaptors sometimes so they buy an audio/interface with better connections on it in the first place usually after that.
 
http://www.sweetwater.com/shop/cables/
 
Just one place on the Internet, and or a local electronic store that carries adaptors and cables and whatever is needed to make the connections.
 
Consumer electronics (stereo amp) usually has RCA phono connectors (like the Delta).
Professional electronics usually have XLR connections or line out 1/4" connections (like a guitar cord or balanced type cord).
That is about it.
 
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MSLCM2/
 
just one cord type and about any type is made. (or an adaptor one can buy).
http://www.sweetwater.com/c812--Adapters
Just have to find one that fits the connections you have. (whether on-line store or at your local electronics store or GC whatever).
 
I would not necessarily get Hosa cables because if you had a Neutrick combination connector in the front for mic, or guitar or synth or whatever in the front of an audio/interface they probably get stuck and end up breaking the connector to get it out or take the unit apart to get it out without destroying the unit.
Audio/interface just to show the combination type connector in the front for input they use nowadays.
http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/DuoCaptureEX/
 
But then I don't think you have such a connector as shown on the front of that unit.
 
2014/03/06 13:36:10
spacealf
And again the best way depending on what your lineoutput of your amp does and what it simulates or whether any effects are also on the line out or the pre-amps out or whether you just mic your amp and play your guitar through the amp. Whatever way works.
Impedence may be a factor on older equipment (but according to RME people not so much with newer equipment).
 
2014/03/06 13:52:16
seed
thanks so much spacealf....i'm just trying to take your post in and absorb!
 
"You have the balanced XLR Connector usually used for low impedence or a microphone. Impedence may not matter much anymore."  - Would this mean i could plug a mic into this input directly?
 
"So on your guitar amp you have pre-amp out or line out which is that input, but first you need connectors that plug into the Delta."  - Both of these outputs are 1/4".....could i not connect one of these to the 1/4" inputs on my Delta?
 
"Unfortunately they are phono RCA type connections and used more for stereo amp setups or consumer setups." - Wouldn't this behringer item fix that?  I could plug a 1/4" into it and output via the RCA cables (into the RCA of the Delta)?
 
 
I'm a little confused when you are mentioning phono/headphone inputs/outputs.
I'm pretty sure my guitar amp has a 1/4" headphone output as well as the line out and preamp out as mentioned earlier
 
 
"Because of all of that, people tend to get an audio/interface that has better connections instead of using adaptors." - Would this Behringer serve that purpose?  What is different between this and what you are recommending?
 
 
 
 
THANKS SO MUCH
I'm not sure i could do this without the confidence and guidance yall offer here
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
2014/03/06 17:06:06
AT
You can hook up a mic to the xlr connection - it goes to the mic preamp onboard the card.  If you have a shure 57 that is a classic guitar cab mic and you will get to learn all about mic placement.  Any placement will work, but the right placement will sound great.  Live and learn.
 
To connect your guitar direct, you need a direct box (or an external mic preamp w/ one).  The behringer might have one - I couldn't tell.  If the connection below the xlr says hi-z you could use that and plug your guitar right in, and then hook the mixer into the delta line in (just as a mic preamp amplifies the small mic signal to line level, so does a DI for your guitar/bass).
 
If you use the guitar amp out, use the line level to the delta line in.  The preamp out should go to another speaker, I would guess.  But that might work too, as long as it ain't a powered output.  That will fry whatever you are likely to plug it into except another speaker.
 
The Delta is a good unit - old but good sounding.  It looks like the behringer mixer has a usb audio output.  You can't use both it and the Delta at once, but it may be simpler for you to get started.
 
The keyboard will work fine via USB as you have discovered.  You can choose it or the midi in on the Delta (if it has one), but it will be simpler to use midi over usb.  Midi and audio ins and outs to SONAr can be set in Options>Preferences (I think - preferences is there somewhere).
 
@
2014/03/06 17:24:55
seed
thanks everyone
i'm still kind of confused but i guess i need to just start plugging and playing and see what happens
 
obvs the only thing i have to lose is frying my card.....but i'm thinking that as long as i'm using this behringer that it won't be possible? 
 
i guess first i'll try plugging a mic directly to the card and then from there try to plug a mic or guitar into the behringer and then use the RCA out of the behringer to the RCA in of the soundcard
i have that phantom power switch on the behringer i can play with
 
if all that doesn't work i can try outputting the behringer to the soundcard via USB?
 
if i need "more juice" for my guitar then i will try doing a line or preamp out into the mixer....then into the card.
 
 
 
if anything sounds off here please let me know
and addtional comments/links are surely helpful
 
cheers! :)
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