robert_e_bone

PJH


I'm having exactly the same issues running two Delta1010s. 

I did ask you if you had tried using the WDM drivers but you didn't respond.

I have tried everything that has been mentioned on the M Audio site (cpu throttling, changing BIOS settings etc with no luck.

My final resort was to go back to WDM and I haven't been able to reproduce the problem since.

I don't think that temperature has anything tp do with it. 

It sounds more like badly written ASIO drivers.

I'll stick with WDM from now on.

Hi Pete. What latency does wdm give you? Also, have you tried one prior driver release?



Bob Bone

Hi Bob,


I can't give you actual numbers as the studio is all locked up at the moment but I can tell you that the latency was actually pretty good.


I can play soft synths etc in virtually real time with no hint of latency.

In fact the whole system seems very stable and is running well.

Hey, I might even make the jump to X2 now.

I didn't bother with a prior release because I went through the M Audio forums and could see that this is a problem that's been around for quite a while.  

Time will tell..... the problem with the distortion is that it is intermittent which make finding the solution even harder.

I have a big week ahead of me. We're shooting the third video for my own album and I'll be doing some mixing and tracking another project doing drums etc so we'll see how everything behaves.

I'll keep you posted.

Cheers, 

Peter.

ok, i tried wdm for the 1000 time using cakewalk programs and it still seems to 1) not sound as good, and 2) really bad latency. so back to asio.  running 6.08, tool out the usb 2.0 internet connection, placed record bit depth at 32, render bit 32, reboot computer and it seem to have recorded fine with out the overlay of reverb type sound we are talking about. seems that playing with bit depth and latency time plays some part it this. for a while i thought it was LOUD signals that were sparking the reverb sound...
running card at 96000 2048 , when i go to r( the reason i thought this is sometimes when echo is on the track((so that you can hear the voice in real time while recording)) it seemed to do this tank sounding reverb tone over the signal)  -then i would take the preamp signal down a bit restart computer and it was fine. there is something strange about all this. the way it is intermitten. somedays it's not an issue at all. but this could very well be a usb 2 problem with my mother board. this is a i-5 asus from best buy. the reason i went back to pci slot cards was this machine. it hated usb2 line 6 ux8... it made this reverb tone all the time, and had poor latency. when these pci cards work well, that work great ... however recording other people in this studio at this point is going to be a headache, and i just don't have 2000 dollars for a card that already has 16 audio ins on it and     works great. not an option money wise. so i continue to struggle and ask people on these boards if they have figured it out. exactly how many parts need replaced on these? you said caps? how many and what do they look like?

Hi everyone:
I have been using 3 Delta 1010s for 30 channels out, 24 analogs and 6 via Spdif.
1. I am on Sonar X1, AMD 6 cores, and Giga MB, 64 bit Win 7. 
2. I use the WDM driver, and at 128 samples, I got 2.7ms, very comfortable to play soft synth.  I can also go down to 64 samples, and get like 1.3ms in latency.
 3. I have tried ASIO many times and there is absolutely no difference between the 2.
4. I never had to sync them via spdif. All 3 of mine have worked with internal sync for a long time now.
5. I finally bought a Lucid clock to sync them after reading on Gearsluts for the longest time.  I can tell you that:
5.a. no change to the sound at all.
5.b. but, and a big but, it seems to keep them sync together very well, because since I got the clock, things are very tight.  Maybe this is what members on GS have been hearing, and to them tighter means better.
5.c. before the clock, sometimes during the middle of the song, the kick and the bass got drifted away at a couple places during mix down, eventhough all the tracks timing are right on. And eventhough I always have the bass and the kick on the same card, for syncing matter.
5.d. yes I did try before the clock, syncing the 3 cards via Spdif, and the timing drift was still there. 
The distortion will stop from turning off stuff in the BIOS, like turbo and couple of other things that have been posted for 3 years now on the Delta 1010 forum.
You need to disable these things in order for the Delta 1010 to work good.
And finally, yes the Delta control panel says 6.08 while the device reports that it is 5.10.0.5078 .
dan

Great post Dan LE.

Bob Bone

dan le


Hi everyone:
I have been using 3 Delta 1010s for 30 channels out, 24 analogs and 6 via Spdif.
1. I am on Sonar X1, AMD 6 cores, and Giga MB, 64 bit Win 7. 
2. I use the WDM driver, and at 128 samples, I got 2.7ms, very comfortable to play soft synth.  I can also go down to 64 samples, and get like 1.3ms in latency.
 3. I have tried ASIO many times and there is absolutely no difference between the 2.
4. I never had to sync them via spdif. All 3 of mine have worked with internal sync for a long time now.
5. I finally bought a Lucid clock to sync them after reading on Gearsluts for the longest time.  I can tell you that:
5.a. no change to the sound at all.
5.b. but, and a big but, it seems to keep them sync together very well, because since I got the clock, things are very tight.  Maybe this is what members on GS have been hearing, and to them tighter means better.
5.c. before the clock, sometimes during the middle of the song, the kick and the bass got drifted away at a couple places during mix down, eventhough all the tracks timing are right on. And eventhough I always have the bass and the kick on the same card, for syncing matter.
5.d. yes I did try before the clock, syncing the 3 cards via Spdif, and the timing drift was still there. 
The distortion will stop from turning off stuff in the BIOS, like turbo and couple of other things that have been posted for 3 years now on the Delta 1010 forum.
You need to disable these things in order for the Delta 1010 to work good.
And finally, yes the Delta control panel says 6.08 while the device reports that it is 5.10.0.5078 .
dan

You say that you used WDM drivers with your 1010s for years without problems. You then go on to mention that you experienced timing and synch issues. That doesn't sound like they were working correctly.


I have resorted to WDM(KS) and will test it in the next week. 


Making those BIOS changes do NOT fix the problem that we and a whole lot of others on the M Audio forum are having. M Audio is very conveniently "ignoring" these posts. They don't have an answer.


There are at least five posts with the same problem. None of them have been assisted. I have written to M Audio in the hope of a reply. None yet.


I do agree with you that there in no difference in sound between the two drivers. Latency for me also has not changed at all. The synch? Well I'll see this week.


But the point I'm trying to make here is that the problem that we're having is not as easy to fix as changing BIOS settings.

question can i have my recording bit depth at 32 and my render at 32 bit with a delta card? the delta is 24/96?

also distortion is back, starting to think i might have to replace all the capasators, does anyone know what kind they are or do i have to take it all apart to find a number on em. seems like i saw a photo of it and there were like 50 small ones and a few large power output ones? could this really be the mysterous distortion tone over my recordings some times?

also of note, today i seperated the delta s on my rack space so that they don't give off as much heat. when it is hot in the studio and the air is off, it sure seems to mess up the deltas a bit. and could the fact that when they are more hot tip us off that it may indeed be caps?

Hi everyone:
I am responding to the OP issue of distortion.
The syncing is another matter altogether. Everytime you have more than 1 device, I think you will need a clock. After all, you can pick up a clock used for no more than $350. So it is not like skyfall.
About the distortion, it might be the caps in the break out box. But before jumping to conclusion, let's do this:

1. Download another DAW under the full trial mode.  Reaper comes to my mind, because the program is short and fairly easy to use.
2. Try to record anything for like 30 minutes.  If you don't exprerience any noise, then it is not the Delta.
3. if you do have distortion, then it is either the driver or the Delta.
4. I can tell you for sure that the Delta driver, the last one is fairly good.
5. if it is not the breakout box, then take off 1 pci card and just use 1 Delta card and interchange between the 2 break out boxes. Record again with both Sonar, and the other DAW.
6. if you were on a 32 bit Win XP before and you had no problem, and now you are on Win 7 64 bit, then it is the driver as mentionned in the Delta forum.
7. lastly, it seems like people with AMD core like myself are having less problems with the Delta 1010. Strange but someone here (our forum) did mention it as well.

One thing I can tell you for sure that if it is the caps, you will always have noise. Not just once in a while. Caps don't make noise when cold, but after a while, they can do some real damage.

OK, and lastly, if it is the caps, then open the breakout box. facing towards you, on the left, there are like 7 or 8 caps at the power supply side. If you can replace them with Nichicon caps. Cost no more than 40 bucks. It will be good as new.

Follow this thread:

http://delta.brainiac.com/delta1010capfix.html
 
Before anyone gives up on the Delta 1010, I just want to let you know that even the folks at Black Lion Audio said that the built of the this box is actually very good.  They used to do a mod on the Delta 1010, but after the issues with the 64 bit driver, they stopped doing it, because people always blame them and not M-Audio for their finicky drivers.
Best.

FYI, after i put a fan on these units i have not had any more problems with em. also installed air conditioning this week. it was most certainly  an over heating problem. when i get money i will replace some of the cans even though they all are not bulged. thankx for the help guys. i love this forum. keep up the good work.

dan le, are you able to use a higher sampling rate with all those cards or is 128  as high as it goes for that many pci ports? also do you ever over heat? and what is the spacing on that many delta 1010's?

I just heard from M Audio support about this distortion. I sent him a sample of the problem and got the response that "the Windows 7 driver does not support multiple Delta cards."
 
He provided a link to this FAQ that provides more details.
 
http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=support.faq&ID=22fae244be874f04a2afa62246ef1739
 
At the moment I'm running two Delta 1010s but am forced to use them in WDM mode. They do seem to work though but I'd like to hear from any other Delta users about this.
 
Cheers,
 
Peter.