• SONAR
  • Saved by Forum Gurus! (Tons of random X3 tips for a frustrated 8.5 guy) (p.3)
2014/01/09 22:55:41
robert_e_bone
I have a confession to make - I still use Step Sequencer for drums.  I keep meaning to get to PRV, just never quite have enough coffee in me to invest the needed learning time.
 
I WILL get around to it, it's the 'when' that eludes me...
 
Bob Bone
 
2014/01/09 22:58:33
scook
To change a MIDI track to the inline PRV set the edit filter to Notes. I have used it a little but mostly work in the PRV out of habit.
2014/01/10 01:15:20
Vastman
mudgel
To the OP.
I've been an annual upgrader since about Cakewalk 7 so my learning curve has been gradual with only a small annual jump to keep up.

THEN X1 arrived; so many technical issues I couldn't even use it until the C patch and then right up to X2 I fought the new work flow and insisted that Sonar bend to my will. Man was I ticked off with Cakewalk. While my gripes were genuine with the X1 series my attitude really got in the way of making headway.

It wasn't until I let go of Sonar 8.5 and committed to learning how the Sonar X series does things that I started to progress. By the time X3 had come along, not only have I been able to make the best of it but I've done it at a time when the Cakewalk team seems to have become revitalised and everything seems pretty good with the Gibson acquisition, unlike the previous Roland days.

If you had the chops to do all those great things with previous versions of Sonar, then I'm sure in time you'll be able to do even more as you come to grips with the changes and improvements that X3 brings to the table. As all the previous posters have suggested there are ways to move forward as long as you take the time to learn Sonars way and not try to impose your old workflow and techniques.

Admittedly there's still a way to go with Sonars development but the Cakewalk team have really got their act together and X3 is by far the best Cakewalk offering in my nearly 20 years of association.

All the best with you endeavours.



Mudgel!  I remember your posts!!!  Back then I was such a casual user (actually, till now) but I'd check in the forums whenever I was trying to do something way back when Sonar WAS NOT INTUITIVE AT ALL...and your frustrations... I always read them, saying to myself... here's a smart guy and he's frustrated so no wonder I'm lost, as I'M A DUMMY!
 
I guess I am lucky, in a sense, to just be getting to the time in my life where I'm able to spend lots of time using Sonar to write songs which have been piling up for years... I never learned my way around 6,7,8,8.5, although 8.5 started to make sense to me... then, X came and I was overwhelmed again but still had little time... and now, with X3... I find myself just doing stuff organically and that methods are much more intuitive, thus, easier to incorporate into my sessions...
 
Muscle memory can really get in the way of moving on...we are creatures of habits... Glad I didn't have any as X3 is worth habituating....
 
Gotta get those hot keys into my brain... printed them out... gotta start studying them... been thinkin of makin an mp3, just speaking them out, one by one, so I can drill it into my brain while gardening...  oh, and I just LOVE Sonar now... 
 
 BTW, why don't people change the thread's title as an issue evolves to better reflect the thread's contents?  This thread has lots of good stuff in it for new/novice or even old fogies like me but it just sounds like another whiner thread... something like... "Sonar X3 is very challenging to us with old habits and I'm both confused and frustrated (lots of tips)...
 
I mean, the title just reflects an emotional but inaccurate rant and lots of good stuff flowed... 
2014/01/10 01:49:24
John
I think its also expectations and approach. When X1 came out I was able to read the manual prior to actually using it. This opened my eyes a bit to the new way of doing things.  Right off, I was able to understand some basic things about X1 that others where having a lot of trouble with. It wasn't that I was smarter. What it was was an acceptance that I had to rethink Sonar and that what I had learned through out the years no longer applied. That didn't upset me. It challenged me. I found it exciting and rewarding to learn Sonar all over again. 
 
I could very much understand how many didn't have the same view. What allowed me to think in such positives ways was I had already come to see the old Sonar as close to going as far as it could. How much can you tack on to a program that relies on icons to do just about everything? I remember having long debates with a member that was advocating a new way to present Sonar. Make it more consistent and streamlined. She was right. I was wrong. I didn't realize it until X1 came out.  
 
Mike V was never, as I recall, so angry that his good sense was abandoned. Yes, he had a hard time but instead of confrontation he chose to meet the trouble head on and change how he did things.   
 
Now he has gone back to the extremely helpful and thoughtful member he always was.  I'm not sure he ever left that position. 
 
Those that are used to pre X Sonar and know nothing about the X series will have to deal with a shock. Those that never used Sonar wont have a hard time and those that have an open mind about it will also have a good time with it. 
2014/01/10 03:17:51
Sanderxpander
JKO, thanks for your example - I don't use manual tempo changes very often so I had never noticed they don't move when you insert or delete time. This would qualify to me as a bug. Have you submitted it?

About the midi automatically becoming one clip, I believe this happens if you record in overdub mode. That means as you record on the same track, everything will be put into a single clip, completely doing away with take lanes. There are no layers anymore however.
2014/01/10 03:35:11
Kev999
Sanderxpander
I don't use manual tempo changes very often so I had never noticed they don't move when you insert or delete time. This would qualify to me as a bug.



Maybe it's a new X3 bug, but Insert works fine for me in X2a. I just tested it out by inserting a single measure in a project that contained tempo changes and several different time signatures.  Everything, including tempo changes and time signatures, shifted along to the right the way it's meant to.
2014/01/10 03:51:30
icontakt
Sanderxpander

About the midi automatically becoming one clip, I believe this happens if you record in overdub mode. That means as you record on the same track, everything will be put into a single clip, completely doing away with take lanes. There are no layers anymore however.


Unfortunately, this doesn't happen in Sonar.
2014/01/10 04:02:31
icontakt
As for Inline PRV, note that the grid lines don't follow the snap setting (although notes DO snap according to the setting), which means it's hard to edit a song that has lots of triplets in it.
2014/01/10 04:51:35
Splat
> I think the biggest hurdle for me is zooming and navigating to what I'm interested in editing quickly
 
Zoom shortcuts
SHIFT click on Zoom buttons = Make largest/smallest zoom.
CTRL + Arrow keys = Best way to Zoom!
Hold down Z, Select area = Zoom in on that area! Alt-Z undos this!
F = Fit tracks to the window
SHIFT + F = Fit project to window
AlT-Z = Undoes a screen action.
SHIFT Double click a clip = Maximizes it.
F11 = Full screen mode
SHIFT-Z = Enable/disable auto Zoom on tracks.
2014/01/10 05:40:49
GARYTHEBRIDGE
I found the SWA Tutorials extremely useful and , not to forget, Brandon and Seth's Sonar X2 demo on Cake TV !
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