.CWP, or Cakewalk Project files, are the native file format. They contain all project settings and MIDI data, but no audio, only references to audio.

.CWB, or Cakewalk Bundle files, are the archive file format. They contain project settings, MIDI data, and audio data. Because they contain the actual audio, they will always be larger than the .CWP file.

When you open a Bundle file (.CWB or .BUN) SONAR must extract the audio from the file and write it to disk.

When you open a Project file (.CWP or .WRK) SONAR does not need to extract the audio. The audio is already present in the Wave Data folder or the project folder (if you use Per Project Audio). Since it does not need to extract the audio, it is faster to open the .CWP file than the .CWB file.

For day to day work, .CWP is the way to go.

For archival purposes, use .CWB.

Better yet, don't use .CWB at all. Use SONAR's Per Project Audio feature and simply copy the project folder to CD or DVD as data. The project folder contains the .CWP file and a subfolder named Audio, containing all the project's audio data.

If you want to clean your disk of any unnecessary audio data before archiving, I recommend CWAF, the Cakewalk Audio Finder utility, on the SONAR 3 CD. It's much more powerful and flexible than Clean Audio Disk.

ORIGINAL: RRabbi

the projects take longer to load and altogether take up more hd space (so i'm hearing...)

That's is not normally the case. Projects files generally load much, much quicker than bundles (since the audio does not need to be "unpacked". Something odd is going on with Brad's stuff.

As far as the Clean Audio Folder tool goes, when I run that will it clean the per project audio folders of unused wav files based on what the .cwp specifies? That should take care of some of the clutter I suppose...

Yes, it should identify any audio that is not associated with a project file.

ORIGINAL: keyfuzz

.CWP, or Cakewalk Project files, are the native file format. They contain all project settings and MIDI data, but no audio, only references to audio.

.CWB, or Cakewalk Bundle files, are the archive file format. They contain project settings, MIDI data, and audio data. Because they contain the actual audio, they will always be larger than the .CWP file.

When you open a Bundle file (.CWB or .BUN) SONAR must extract the audio from the file and write it to disk.

When you open a Project file (.CWP or .WRK) SONAR does not need to extract the audio. The audio is already present in the Wave Data folder or the project folder (if you use Per Project Audio). Since it does not need to extract the audio, it is faster to open the .CWP file than the .CWB file.

For day to day work, .CWP is the way to go.

For archival purposes, use .CWB.

Better yet, don't use .CWB at all. Use SONAR's Per Project Audio feature and simply copy the project folder to CD or DVD as data. The project folder contains the .CWP file and a subfolder named Audio, containing all the project's audio data.

If you want to clean your disk of any unnecessary audio data before archiving, I recommend CWAF, the Cakewalk Audio Finder utility, on the SONAR 3 CD. It's much more powerful and flexible than Clean Audio Disk.

All good recommendations, keyfuzz!

One clarification - while the .CWB file will be bigger than the .CWP file itself, the .CWP file AND all of it's associated audio files should be roughly the same size the the .CWB. The main difference between the two is that one has the audio in it and the other doesn't. Therefore when including the audio with the .cwp the size should be essentially equivalent.

Also, in earlier versions of Sonar, when you created a .cwb ALL the audio was compacted into one large wave file. I don't know if it still does this, but I imagine it does.

ORIGINAL: dachay2tnr
All good recommendations, keyfuzz!

One clarification - while the .CWB file will be bigger than the .CWP file itself, the .CWP file AND all of it's associated audio files should be roughly the same size the the .CWB. The main difference between the two is that one has the audio in it and the other doesn't. Therefore when including the audio with the .cwp the size should be essentially equivalent.

Yes, that's true. Thanks for the clarification. Didn't mean to imply the total sizes were different, but always best to be absolutely clear.

Also, in earlier versions of Sonar, when you created a .cwb ALL the audio was compacted into one large wave file. I don't know if it still does this, but I imagine it does.

I don't use bundles now that Per Project Audio is available, so I don't know offhand. It used to unpack them as a single monolithic WAV file, too. In fact, a quick check shows this to still be true.

Just to possibly muddy the waters further....

I do both. I have a current CWP, and a version on another drive saved as a cwb.

Not only does this give me some peace of mind ( I did have a "work in progress" cwp get corrupted today, so it doesn't just happen to cwbs..), but it does help keep projects from growing too large.

Even if you diligently delete truley uneeded files, trim clips and clean audio folders, there are still scraps of wav files around that never really get deleted in the cwp.
If you doubt this, do some experiments and you'll verify it. CW will verify this also.

I've had projects completed where trimmed clips, saved, cleaned audio folder and then saved a redundant CWB also.
The CWP with its audio folder could be 700 mb whereas the resulting CWB ends up 100-200 mb smaller.

This may be the "apply trimming" waste that is never really purged from the project. I can't say for sure, but I've tested this enough time to feel like occasionally bundling the file during the process keeps it a bit leaner. I do enough redundant backups of client projects that keeping all of them as lean as possible reduces load/archive times and media. It adds up over the course of 20-30 clients.

Find a method that works for you, but don't rule out ways where the bundle file and the CWP file format can be used to your advantage in all phases of the project.

Once you have started a file with audio stored in (e.g. D:CakewalkProjects/Audio/), an audio directory that just sweeps in all audio files from any *.cwp project without a stored directory, is there any way to convert the storage format so the whole project has a single directory with the *.cwp and an ../Audio directory? I usually use this format, but sometimes I just start with an Untitled workspace to explore some feature I want to learn more about, and end up with good material that turns into a project...I would prefer to continue with it in single folder storage mode.
 
Also, is there any way to rename a project?? 
 
May sound silly, but I get tired of naming projects with datecodes, and then having a notebook that identifies them all. It would be nice if I could rename everything once it gets more shape.

*** OLD THREAD ALERT ***
 
But to answer your questions, first make sure you've got  "Enable Per Project Folders" checked in Preferences
 
Then, with a project open, simply do a "save as" to your preferred location. This will allow you to rename the project but please ensure you have "Copy Audio With Project"checked in the Save As dialog box.
 
If you choose to save each project in this way, when you've finished you can delete the contents of the Global Audio folder along with all your old project cwp files