I'm just wondering what's going on... trying to understand...
 
I understand gain structure pretty well... I've been dealing with it for enough decades... ;-)
 
Why is it that if I have a clip whose gain is not clipping frequently presenting too much gain to the ProChannel plugins, but not if I bypass the gain...
 
I mean, even the first device... I have a peak of near -0.6 and when feeding into either the PC76 or the CA2a it immediately will have gain overs feeding into it... I would expect the input to handle gain coming into it below clipping...
 
Please... it would be very comforting if someone could explain the gain issue here? Thanks...
 
Keni
 

I'm not following you Keni. 
 
"Why is it that if I have a clip whose gain is not clipping frequently presenting too much gain to the ProChannel plugins, but not if I bypass the gain..."
 
That is very hard to decipher. At least for me it is. 

Yup please take us through step by step. Tell us what you do and say what you see :)

Thanks guys...

Sorry for not being more clear...

It's like this simply put...

I have a track that is not clipping and I send it into the PC76 with no gain boost... Now I get some clipping in the ProChannel...

How can less than zero peak be too much signal for the input?....

I hope I just used the correct plugin to illustrate this as some compressors increase gain with the input control to adjust the compressor's threshold... While others adjust a trigger level without increasing gain at the front end...

I'm just very surprised and confused when below zero level is fed into a device and it's not even enough to trigger the device's gain changing (no compression is yet taking place) and the device's output is unity gain?

I never saw this kind of sensitivity when running standard VSTs but then again Sonar didn't display gain led or such feeding the FX bin...?

I know that there is never any signal over zero as it is digitally clipped there... So I don't understand how non-clipping audio can be too hot to feed a line level device...?

Thanks... I hope that was a bit more clear... I'll do my best to do a next reply from the workstation so I might be more precise with my info...

Keni

First off in Sonar a signal over 0 can be processed because its either 32 bit FP or 64 bits FP. Its very hard to actually clip the internal routing of Sonar.
 
My question is how do you know its clipping? For me its the clip indicator light going into the red and staying there. The other thing is why not just lower the volume fader? If this is too low for the compressor to work with adjust its input gain on it.    

Hey Keni
What happened to you? Since you got X3 you have completely changed. I never knew that X3 had such an impact on users. If I were you I would go back to X1 again. At least you looked alive and kicking. Now you look like a museum piece.

Thanks guys...

For new it's the LED indicators as well and they are flashing with occasional red peaks. I find it hard to read this light peak in the PC itself but it's very visible in the inspector or CV...

I'm not understanding how signal below peaking can be too hot to a fixed input supposedly unity gain...? I'm forced to lower the track gain so the feed into the PC doesn't cause overs. I understand how the output gain of these devices might overload the input of the next device in line, but how does the original signal being free of overs be too much for the first device?

Dan... Yeah I've been quiet... Much of X3 is better tho I still liked pre-X better to work in... The X generation has it's advantages and living in the past is not something I can do...

I still dislike Lanes and all the problems they've have introduced... The new comping has some good points but so far I'm still faster before lanes got in my way...

I'm totally frustrated with the zoom issues and as they are Ware and fixing it (?), I'm remaining calm to see what they do with the coming fix...

Complacent? No, but my life is crumbling here as I've lost my heat already, my other bills all in arrears, and my house in jeopardy of foreclosure only days from now... I'm trying to play with X3 to keep my mind off things I can do nothing about but not very focused as the nagging thought of being homeless, broke, and 62 up in the mountains.... Survival is cramping my ability to care too much about anything right now...

Thanks for noticing!

Keni

"I'm not understanding how signal below peaking can be too hot to a fixed input supposedly unity gain...? I'm forced to lower the track gain so the feed into the PC doesn't cause overs. I understand how the output gain of these devices might overload the input of the next device in line, but how does the original signal being free of overs be too much for the first device?"
 
I would check your input setting on the module in question. 

That's the point... If there is no gain control on the front end, it should not be possible to be over going in? Some compressors use an input control to decide threshold, but even there if there is so little signal coming in that such a control is raised yet it's not high enuf to even trigger the compression, how can the LED be showing an over?

Right now the only thing I can do to deal with such is to lower the gain control to lower the feed into the device... This works, but I'm trying to understand how the gain is happening at each of these stages... This part was much more simple in the analog days! ;-)

Keni

I know what you are talking about - and I have seen this myself: the indicator light runs red even though the signal appears to be well under the -0 db threshold; most confusing.