gswitz
@Craig...
I'm guessing that Boston will be more temperate than your home on Mars. ;-)
 
Link so random readers to misinterpret my post.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nek43AmmtC8&list=UUI6SU3tDDe0GOsWWhIIPpBw

Thanks for spreading the link!!

Marcus Curtis
 
Actually I still have my fingers crossed on this one. I hope they address it in the next version. I don't know how high it is on their list of priorities. currently I am waiting for the next survey to come out. I will make it my number one choice for improvement.
 
 

 
It won't happen.  Notation has never been updated in any significant way.  They added track buttons etc.. but the notation has never been addressed and sadly won't.
 

vintagevibe

Marcus Curtis
 
Actually I still have my fingers crossed on this one. I hope they address it in the next version. I don't know how high it is on their list of priorities. currently I am waiting for the next survey to come out. I will make it my number one choice for improvement.
 
 

It won't happen.  Notation has never been updated in any significant way.  They added track buttons etc.. but the notation has never been addressed and sadly won't.
 

I've always been surprised haven't opted for a third party solution. They could have sold it under "Sonar Producer Score Edition" or something and make a few more $$$.... an idea for X4 anyway.

CakeAlexS

vintagevibe

Marcus Curtis
 
Actually I still have my fingers crossed on this one. I hope they address it in the next version. I don't know how high it is on their list of priorities. currently I am waiting for the next survey to come out. I will make it my number one choice for improvement.
 
 

It won't happen.  Notation has never been updated in any significant way.  They added track buttons etc.. but the notation has never been addressed and sadly won't.
 

I've always been surprised haven't opted for a third party solution. They could have sold it under "Sonar Producer Score Edition" or something and make a few more $$$.... an idea for X4 anyway.

I kept hoping they would buy Notion.

vintagevibe

Marcus Curtis
 
Actually I still have my fingers crossed on this one. I hope they address it in the next version. I don't know how high it is on their list of priorities. currently I am waiting for the next survey to come out. I will make it my number one choice for improvement.
 
 

It won't happen.  Notation has never been updated in any significant way.  They added track buttons etc.. but the notation has never been addressed and sadly won't.
 

 
Actually the thing that gives me hope was the fact that the notation issue was on the survey last year when they were developing X3. There was a direct question asking if I would like to see notation improved and there was a list of priorities to arrange. This means that they budget for things we request. but their resources and man power is limited. I don't think they have ruled out notation. I think they are limited by their development budget. As I remember from that survey my first choice of priorities was bug fixes and my second was colors. I am willing to bet notation did not get enough support in the survey.
 
The fact that they asked their customers where they want their resources to go on certain features gives me hope. I think the notation was my 4th pick on the survey. Maybe it did not get a lot of votes from internal customers that time around. I think the bakers know we would like to see it. but where it is on the list of priorities is unknown. 

Marcus Curtis

vintagevibe

Marcus Curtis
 
Actually I still have my fingers crossed on this one. I hope they address it in the next version. I don't know how high it is on their list of priorities. currently I am waiting for the next survey to come out. I will make it my number one choice for improvement.
 
 

It won't happen.  Notation has never been updated in any significant way.  They added track buttons etc.. but the notation has never been addressed and sadly won't.
 

 
Actually the thing that gives me hope was the fact that the notation issue was on the survey last year when they were developing X3. There was a direct question asking if I would like to see notation improved and there was a list of priorities to arrange. This means that they budget for things we request. but their resources and man power is limited. I don't think they have ruled out notation. I think they are limited by their development budget. As I remember from that survey my first choice of priorities was bug fixes and my second was colors. I am willing to bet notation did not get enough support in the survey.
 
The fact that they asked their customers where they want their resources to go on certain features gives me hope. I think the notation was my 4th pick on the survey. Maybe it did not get a lot of votes from internal customers that time around. I think the bakers know we would like to see it. but where it is on the list of priorities is unknown. 

They do that in every survey going back over 15 years.  I've been waiting at least that long.  Trust me.  It won't happen.  I've even been told by Cakewalk staff that they would never do any major upgrades to notation.  Avid, MOTU, Steinberg and even Presonus have done great things as far as notation but for some reason Cakewalk doesn't think it matters.

They may have thought it didn't matter at one time in the past, but things do change! With the competition doing something with their notation, CW may feel the competitive pressure.

Also with the new Skylight UI, they may have already a plan in place for a major reworking of the SV.

You just never know.

This is NOT "official Cakewalk opinion," just my take on the situation as a long-time Sonar user.
 
To do pro-level, engraving-quality notation, it's necessary to have software that's more or less dedicated to that task, like Sibelius or Finale. These cost about the same as X3 Producer. Notation programs have a tiny market share; DAWs, virtual instruments, and effects are about 85% of the music software market. Notation programs don't even show up as a category in most sales surveys, but are lumped with "others" or "misc."
 
So with respect to Sonar, it's pretty pointless to devote massive amount of resources to providing pro level notation, especially in terms of going against entrenched competition. Those who just want to print out a quick lead sheet can use pretty basic notation which is available in most DAWs, including Sonar.
 
So, that leaves those who are more "middle of the road" and simply want to be able to interface with a DAW using their preferred method, i.e., notation. They don't need engraving quality, but they want something that is accurate and efficient.
 
Now we get into areas where I could be wrong, but my understanding is that doing even "middle class"-quality notation is not at all trivial. Also, I believe that in terms of priorities as presented to Cakewalk, decent quality notation falls more into the "vocal minority" category. So if a ton of people want VST3 support, or ARA integration with Melodyne, it's more likely their needs will pop to the top of the stack.
 
X3d is slated to have numerous video enhancements. If you consider how many people are uploading to YouTube versus those who want to use notation as their primary means of interacting with Sonar, I'm quite sure the numbers favor those who want to upload to YouTube.
 
Although I rarely need to use notation, I fully understand why some users would want to be able to work primarily with notation, especially if that's how they were raised musically. It's simply faster and more fluid for them. The MusicXML export feature is fine for those who want to print notation, but not useful for interaction.
 
Of course you can ReWire Notion into Sonar, which some people find an effective workaround for $99. But what I hope is that at some point, a protocol like ReWire and/or ARA will allow a notation "add on" from a third party that's designed to work specifically with DAWs. Then Sonar users could use notation, but Cakewalk wouldn't have to devote the significant amount of resources required to make it possible.

Anderton
Of course you can ReWire Notion into Sonar, which some people find an effective workaround for $99. But what I hope is that at some point, a protocol like ReWire and/or ARA will allow a notation "add on" from a third party that's designed to work specifically with DAWs. Then Sonar users could use notation, but Cakewalk wouldn't have to devote the significant amount of resources required to make it possible.

If a 3rd party notation program like Finale, Sibelius, or Notion could be exposed to work with in SONAR like X3 integrated ARA, that sounds like it would be the better way to have support for notation programs in SONAR, in view of Craig's excellently voiced opinion of why it's unlikely that Cake would revise the notation support provided by SONAR.
 
And while we're into expressing our wishful thinking, I think it would be a great idea to update the Cakewalk MP3 Encoder to include an option to use Average Bit Rate encoding. It can also be updated to use the latest LAME release 3.99.5. I don't think there ever was an update of the Cakewalk MP3 Encoder. Updating it can't be that hard to do. Can it?
 
Just thought I'd throw that last bit of wishful thinking in.

I have to think that Avid, MOTU, Steinberg and Presonus expect to get returns on their outlays for notation.  Just the education market alone is potentially profitable.  My take is that Cakewalk has avoided it so long that now it would be to hard.  When the 1st Windows 3.1 Cakewalk was released it had the best notation on the Windows platform.  Craig, what's your take on why Avid, MOTU, Steinberg and Presonus have spent resources on notation?