• SONAR
  • How using sonar SYSEX (system exclusive) to send style, sound,etc from PC to Keyboard?
2013/10/22 08:49:01
ramtin
Hi,
 Dear Friends,
As before explained, I had connected My old keyboard “Technics SX KN 1000” to PC “windows Xp” via midi cable, using Cakewalk Express 8. As my keyboard has been not equipped by any external memory such as floppy drive, CD rom, flash memory ,USB flash ,…I have to use SYSEX (system exclusive) to send a backup of Styles, sound and anything which I had set on my keyboard and ultimately save as SYX extension using sonar in My PC for future needs.
I have no problem to send the data which are allowed. And send from the keyboard wherever easily receive them through Sonar by syx Extension. But when I load the syx file in Sonar, which recently has received it from the keyboard, and going to send it back to the keyboard, the keyboard cannot receive the file and a massage is appeared on the keyboard screen ”Receive Error”. However, in Sonar, there appear “send” windows, which show the sending process is done. It does mean that the data is sending from Sonar but the keyboard cannot receive it for a reason that I do not know it. I would be thankful if anybody who is professional or experienced on the mentioned, help me to solve the matter.
Regards
Ramtin       
2013/10/22 09:50:30
js516
I'm not sure where in Express 8 you will find this setting, but you may need to increase the number of SysEx buffers. In the X series, you can find the setting here:
 
http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation/default.aspx?Doc=SONAR%20X2&Lang=EN&Req=Dialogs2.060.html
 
Older keyboards are slower and susceptible to midi buffer failure when sent large blocks of SysEx data at an inconsistent speed. To compensate you need to increase the number of buffers in Sonar.
 
It is also possible that the SysEx dump may be bad. Do you have a SysEx librarian for the KN1000 to verify that the dump is valid?
2013/10/22 20:19:44
bvideo
Have a look at these parameters in the TTSseq.ini file. I think you will need to throttle the sysex data rate sent by Sonar to your synth.
 
SysxSendDelayMsecs=n
 
SysxDelayAfterF7=n
 
SysxSendPacketSize=n
 
The number of sysex buffers is only for Sonar to receive from your synth, so if you think Sonar didn't receive the whole thing, increase that.
2013/10/23 02:40:53
Mystic38
I suspect if you try reducing the project tempo to ~80bpm you will slow the sysex transmission rate to such that the keyboard can cope.
2013/10/23 02:53:02
ramtin
Dear js516 
thanks for your reply,I checked the number of buffers in Cakewalk Express 8 and it was 256.

unfortunately  I have not any SysEx librarian for the KN1000 to verify that the dump is valid.If you have it,could i ask you to share it with me to check whether dose it work?
 
Dear Bvideo
I check TTSseq in Cakewalk Express 8.The parameters which you mentioned ( SysxSendDelayMsecs=n, SysxDelayAfterF7=n, SysxSendPacketSize=n) dose not existed in the file.all the parameters which is inside the TTSseq are as follow:
[Options]
AutoConfigureMidi=0
SysxEchoEnabled=0
PumpDataMsec=500
LocalOnPort=-1
SysxRecordBuffers=256
SysxRecordEnabled=1
[MIDI Input Devices]
MaxInPort=-1
[MIDI Output Devices]
0=Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth
MaxOutPort=0
2013/10/23 09:01:50
js516
I use a general purpose editor and librarian called "midiquest xl" made by a company called soundquest. It doesn't support the kn1000 unfortunately.

Try doubling the size of the buffers. Also try sending the sysex using midiox if you still have problems with Cakewalk Express.

If both options fail, try capturing the dump using midiox.

Unfortunately, sysex is a lot of trial and error without a proper librarian. I tried searching the internet for one , but I was unable to find one.
2013/10/23 11:43:14
bvideo
ramtin,
Those cakewalk files don't always contain every parameter supported. Missing ones just use defaults. If express 8 supports those parameters, you might find the defaults and a description of what the parameters do in the manual or help file. That will help you estimate what parameters to add to slow down sysex transmission for your synth. Some trial and error may be useful to find slow enough values that don't slow you down too much. In Sonar, the manual actually discusses values to try if the synthesizer reports midi data errors.
 
The support files for express 8 are non-responsive at the moment, but have a look at this support page for pro audio.
 
Try adding these:
SysxDelayAfterF7=1 (default was 0)

SysxSendPacketSize=64 (default was 1024)

SysxSendDelayMsecs=60   (then try higher numbers)

2013/10/25 08:42:53
ramtin
Dear Bvideo
thanks for your advice,
I will try to change the setting and find the result.
2013/10/29 02:27:39
ramtin
Dear ,
actually I have added the following setting to TTSseq in cakewalk express 8 but unfortunately, when I transferred the Sysex to keyboard (however I had recorded it from my keyboard to cakewalk express 8) the "receive error" was appeared.
2013/10/30 02:31:19
ramtin
Dear ,
Actually, I have added the following setting to Cakewalk express 8 TTSseq which had been already recommended by you.
SysxDelayAfterF7=1 (default was 0)

SysxSendPacketSize=64 (default was 1024)

SysxSendDelayMsecs=60   (then try higher numbers)

 
 But unfortunately, when I transferred the Sysex file to My keyboard "Technics Sx KN 1000" , the "receive error" massage was appeare on my Keyboard LCD screen and Sysex file did not transferred.however,I had already recorded the file, from my keyboard in Cakewalk express 8
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