• SONAR
  • How using sonar SYSEX (system exclusive) to send style, sound,etc from PC to Keyboard? (p.2)
2013/10/30 09:59:40
bvideo
That is discouraging.  Does email to tech support help at all? Also, do you see an [Options] section in TTSseq.ini? Those parameters go in the [Options] section. As js516 suggested, it is also possible that the transmission from the synth to the PC had some errors.
 
Today I see that the support pages for express 8 are responding. Here is one that covers the sysex parameters (for "Cakewalk", which sounds like a generic document that should apply to many different products).
2013/10/31 02:42:11
ramtin
Dear bvideo,
 
  1. I checked the support page, but unfortunately it is not available more for Cakewalk express 8,
  2. TTSseq in Cakewalk express 8 is included of the fallowing line.
[Options]
AutoConfigureMidi=0
SysxEchoEnabled=0
PumpDataMsec=500
LocalOnPort=-1
SysxRecordBuffers=256
SysxRecordEnabled=1
[MIDI Input Devices]
MaxInPort=-1
[MIDI Output Devices]
0=Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth
MaxOutPort=0
And I have added the below lines that you recommended before:
SysxDelayAfterF7=1 
SysxSendPacketSize=64
SysxSendDelayMsecs=60
   3.  I tried to send and received the sysex file by another software which is called “GNMIDI”,But the result was same.It means that receiving by PC through “GNMIDI”was completely done, but sending back the Technics KN 1000 was not done and again “receive error “ massage was appeared on the keyboard LCD.
  4.  I checked the manual of Technics KN 1000,there was written that if sysex file comes from other instrument except of Technics KN 1000 then the “receive error “ massage will be appeared on the keyboard LCD.
  5.  I think that I have to change some code in Sysex but I don’t have information about these codes.
  6.  How can I email to support tech? Have you any email address? unfortunately my keyboard is not by company producer as the company is not continue its activity on keyboards.
 
But I believe that there is a way to solve the problem and if it is found, it will be a grate opportunity for me to use the old instrument with new technologies. 
2013/10/31 07:23:56
MikeRusso
ramtin - I had a similar problem with my Yamaha CS1x. When using the SysEx menu - Sonar would receive the SysEx file, but the CS1x would not accept a transmission from Sonar. Here is what worked for me. I set up a MIDI track in Sonar and recorded a SysEx dump to that track at a tempo of 80 BPM. I had to start the dump manually from the keyboard as the track was recording. Play back the track and the CS1x received the SysEx data.
 
It may be worth a try...
 
Good luck!
Mike
2013/10/31 07:54:55
Jeff Evans
Hi Ramtin,Sometimes sequencers do not receive and send Sysex data very well. Here is a nice free utility called Midi Ox.
 
http://www.midiox.com/
 
This will receive any sysex data dump from anything. It allows you to save it of course. It sends it back absolutely perfectly everytime. (the only thing is you have to enable the sysex dump to be received of course)
 
I have found this to be the best at this. It wont hurt to try it, you have nothing to loose. The reason why I think it works is because it captures the data dump and does not modify or change it in any way. It then sends it back in the form that the device expects it and therefore it usually works. I have a few tricky instruments that refused to work with a sequencer sending and receiving sysex dumps but MidiOx worked perfectly everytime.
 
I have just downloaded the manual for the Technics and it seems you don't have to do anything to receive the sysex dump other than go to that Page first. (Midi 2 Page 8 'Midi System Exclusive') It seems you have to be on that page first then just send the dump from Midi OX and it should say Midi Receiveing while the dump goes from Computer back to your Technics.
2013/10/31 10:24:21
bvideo
ramtin
Dear bvideo,
 
  1. I checked the support page, but unfortunately it is not available more for Cakewalk express 8,
  2. TTSseq in Cakewalk express 8 is included of the fallowing line.
[Options]
AutoConfigureMidi=0
SysxEchoEnabled=0
PumpDataMsec=500
LocalOnPort=-1
SysxRecordBuffers=256
SysxRecordEnabled=1

 // the new lines should go here in the options section
// (be sure to exit and restart the program after making changes to the file)
SysxDelayAfterF7=1 
SysxSendPacketSize=64
SysxSendDelayMsecs=60

[MIDI Input Devices]
MaxInPort=-1
[MIDI Output Devices]
0=Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth
MaxOutPort=0
And I have added the below lines that you recommended before:
SysxDelayAfterF7=1 
SysxSendPacketSize=64
SysxSendDelayMsecs=60
   3.  I tried to send and received the sysex file by another software which is called “GNMIDI”,But the result was same.It means that receiving by PC through “GNMIDI”was completely done, but sending back the Technics KN 1000 was not done and again “receive error “ massage was appeared on the keyboard LCD.
  4.  I checked the manual of Technics KN 1000,there was written that if sysex file comes from other instrument except of Technics KN 1000 then the “receive error “ massage will be appeared on the keyboard LCD.

You probably don't have to worry about that statement because they are talking about other kinds of instruments, and they will have their own sysex formats, so it is natural they wouldn't work with another kind. With the right software, a PC should work. Quite likely the midiox program mentioned by Jeff Evans will do a good job of playing back the sysex in just the same timing that your synth needs.

  5.  I think that I have to change some code in Sysex but I don’t have information about these codes.
  6.  How can I email to support tech? Have you any email address? unfortunately my keyboard is not by company producer as the company is not continue its activity on keyboards.

The email support contact for cakewalk is here, found starting from the support link on the cakewalk home page. Hopefully they could tell you whether those parameters are supported in express 8. As for #5, I hope not!

 
But I believe that there is a way to solve the problem and if it is found, it will be a grate opportunity for me to use the old instrument with new technologies. 


Thanks to Mike and Jeff for more ideas.
2013/11/02 05:02:55
ramtin
Dear Jeff,Mike and Bvideo,
 
Thanks a lot,for your kind advises and for the times that you have spent to solve my problem. I have gotten that, some of you, in order to help me on the special task,even had downloaded and studied my keyboard manual.And some others, have been visited various websites to find a solution for the case.I would like to express, that it is so valuable for me and it is my pleasure that found such good friends in the forum.
 
I will apply your advises one by one and will come back to you by the result,
Hope to get the conclusion!
2013/11/02 07:29:44
Jeff Evans
Hi ramtin, I hope you find your answer. I suggest starting with my suggestion first and run with Midi Ox. After all you want to do is to be able to send and store and receive midi data dumps and Midi Ox allows you to do exactly just that. You should not and you do not have to get involved in anyway with the actual Sysex data itself. Too hard and totally unnecessary for the purposes you are wanting to achieve.
 
Midi OX does allow you to write your own sysex dumps, alter existing data and do a lot in that respect but it also just allows you to receive and send it back too making it very very easy to use. Like I said if you send it a dump from your Technics, it captures it perfectly and send it back exactly the way the Technics is expecting it.
2013/11/02 07:45:36
MikeRusso
ramtin - good luck with your adventure! As Jeff states, MIDI Ox is a great resource. I run it when necessary as well. And it looks like bvideo has a lot of good data for you also.
 
Hopefully, among the suggstions, you will find your answer.
 
Here to help.
 
Take care!
Mike
2013/11/03 02:30:44
ramtin
Dear Mike,
Thanks a lot for your following. Actually I had tried “MIdiox”, but finally result was the same. I have record SYSEX from Keyboard into MIDIOX and the following commands are the first 3 lines which are recorded by MIDIOX.
F0 50 21 01 10 01 F7
F0 50 21 01 10 01 F7
F0 50 21 01 10 01 F7
As you can find the above commands which received by MIDIOX are same and at the time of sending each line, initially there appears “receiving *……….” Massage on the LCD, but the process does not complete and “error receive” Massage is appeared on the keyboard LCD.It happens 3 times (after sending each line) and then for next commands nothing happens on LCD screen, however MIDIOX sending process is showing. I have brought 2 paragraphs for instance (the full massage is 37814 bytes).
As I have investigated the Value in HEX, has the meaning as below:
F0 : Exclusive status,
50 : Technics ID
21 : Individual data command
01 : KN
10 : Model 1000 (Should be)
01 : data size (Should be)
F7 : End of Exclusive
 
F0 50 26 01 10 01 02 00 05 14 00 10 0B 14 00 15 00 16 0A 10 00 16 05 1B 00 11 00 10 00 10 0A 15 0A 15 0A 15 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 01 10 02 10 03 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 02 11 00 10 08 14 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 6A F7
F0 50 26 01 10 01 02 01 00 10 00 10 01 10 02 10 03 10 04 10 07 10 01 18 00 12 08 15 00 10 00 10 0F 17 0F 17 0F 17 0F 17 08 12 00 10 00 14 00 10 00 15 06 10 00 10 00 10 00 14 00 10 00 15 06 10 08 13 00 10 00 14 00 10 00 15 06 10 01 14 00 10 00 14 00 10 00 15 06 10 0D 12 0D 12 03 16 0C 16 02 17 0D 12 0D 12 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 05 10 00 10 06 10 07 10 08 10 09 10 07 10 01 18 00 12 08 15 00 10 00 10 0F 17 0F 17 0F 17 0F 17 08 12 00 10 00 14 00 10 00 15 06 10 00 10 00 10 00 14 00 10 01 62 F7
And the followings are the last commands.
F0 50 7E 00 10 00 10 00 10 00 10 07 18 00 31 F7
F0 50 27 7E F7
F0 50 28 7E F7
 
Now what is your Idea
2013/11/03 02:49:28
ramtin
Dear Bvideo,
I applied your advice,and added recommended command under [option] part in TTSseq.ini file, but the result was the same as, I Had explained above.I believe that all the problems is came from firs row. F0 50 21 01 10 01 F7 because at the time of sending the line, atfirst there appears “receiving *……….” Massage on the LCD that shows keyboard is ready to receive Sysex , but the process does not complete and“error receive” Massage is appeared on the keyboard LCD. 
I also suspect in  the volume of the file (37814 bytes).I tried to break the SYSEX file and send it in part times.but it did not work.
 
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