I use EWQLSO and I did some eq work on cello and cello arpegio sounds good and quite distinct by itself.
When it's played along with high violin and the rest of orchestra, it loses its distinct sound and sounds more like background effect.
I need both cello and violins to be heard distinctly.
 
I'm wondering if the right delay/compression/distortion could help, but I'm not a mixing expert.
Can anyone share some insight?

EQ. Basically you'll want to find the strongest frequencies in your cello and violin parts (use a frequency analyzer) then go through all your tracks and attenuate (turn down) those frequencies as much as possible wherever you can without making those tracks sound weird (even if they don't sound as good as possible because of this the cello and violin will occupy that space anyway so it won't be that noticeable... check in the context of the mix for the right balance). Then you can use panning and stereo field tricks to isolate things further. Like have the backing orchestra more to the left and right of the stereo field then have the cello and violin more centered.
 
If you have a few bucks I'd recommend going over to Groove3 and checking out some of the mixing vids... particularly the one called EQ Explained for more details on this kind of thing.
 
Good luck.

Ah okay:) Thanks a lot for the reply&recommendation.
This is one section of the piece. so if I turn down certain frequencies of other instruments, I have to change that back when this section end. To me that sounds like quite a bit of work. Is it something that all mixing experts do, or is there a better to handle this kind of issues?


 

cksh.simon
Ah okay:) Thanks a lot for the reply&recommendation.
This is one section of the piece. so if I turn down certain frequencies of other instruments, I have to change that back when this section end. To me that sounds like quite a bit of work. Is it something that all mixing experts do, or is there a better to handle this kind of issues?


 

Getting frequencies out of the way of other instruments is standard mixing practice. Really any time you mix a song you should look at every track and find the main sound of the instrument and remove everything else. Even if you don't hear much in those outer frequencies they can still interfere with other instruments giving a muddy mix. This is why you use Hi and Low pass filters to cut out everything but the main sound. Try it out and you may not have to do anything special for that spot however you could just use automation.
 
But if you REALLY aren't interested in that as I said using pan to disperse the background across the stereo field then having the solo instruments more centered is quite effective as well.

Of course you could always just turn up those parts but I'm assuming you have already tried that. ;-)
 

Hi cksh.simon
People certainly automate EQ settings to make instruments stand out or fade into the background. It's really common for things like acoustic guitar in songs where in some places the acoustic guitar is prominent and in others it's not. More generally, the way to think about it is in terms of having the cello occupy it's own space. In music production the idea of "space" in an important one and can be handled in a few different ways. Here are some:
 
1. Frequency - this is what Beepster was talking about. When you remove some frequencies from other instruments you're carving out a space for whatever you'd like to be heard more. Removing overlapping or cluttered sounds makes instruments all have their own area to live in.
 
2. Depth. This is frequently accomplished with reverb or delay (which are really the same thing anyway...but I digress). Reverb gives the listener the illusion that an instrument is sitting back away from the them. To make an instrument more prominent remove some reverb.
 
3. Stereo field. This is the right to left axis in the stereo field. If each instrument has it's own place in the stereo field it will make them more intelligible and may require less tweaking to stand out in places where you want them to stand out.
 
4. Volume. Volume automation is EXTREMELY common in today's music and perhaps the easiest way to skin this cat. For the section where you want the cello to stand out bump up the volume a bit.
 
5. Time. Many good piano players will delay the melodic notes of a piano piece by just a bit so they don't fall exactly on the chordal, structural parts of the song. It's a really tiny amount so the listener doesn't interpret it as a mistake, but it can really make a difference. If you delay your cello part just a bit for the section you'd like to stand out it can separate it from the rest of the piece. Keep in mind it has to be a small amount or it will sound bad...just a few milliseconds.
 
These techniques frequently work best when used in combination. For example, if you have a section of music where you want the cello to stand out, try moving it's pan position a bit toward center, bumping it up a half db in volume, and removing just a bit of reverb. This gives the illusion that your cello player has moved toward the center of the stage and taken a few steps forward (if you watch jazz, bluegrass or vocal ensembles perform you can actually see performers do that exact thing).
 
Good luck
Dean

So the whole "best answer" and "helpful" stuff is making me absurdly (and entirely un-seriously) competitive. First the OP marked my response as Best, then he switched it to Helpful and marked Beepsters as best?
 
What? Once again I've been bested by Beepster?!?! Curse you, whimsical fate! Damn you capricious gods! Why must the seas of circumstance toss me madly to and fro, from "Best" to merely "Helpful"???
 
Further, why must I always be second to Beepster?!?!?!? Can no one else see he's merely a kitten tapping a dog on the nose?!?!? Am I doomed to be forever beaten by adorable pets engaged in antics who have also somehow learned to type and produce music???
 
(shakes his fist at sky)
BEEEEPPPPSSSTTTEEEEEERRRRRR!!!!!!!
 

I think Beepster and Razorwit's responses are excellent, with Beepster's being more specific and Razorwit's being more general.
 
The concept of cutting frequencies that "step on" other instruments is often overlooked but has wide applicability. When EQing guitar in a singer/songwriter situation, the first thing I do is drop the guitar in the vocal range. The voice becomes way more prominent without having to do anything to the voice itself.
I think the emphasis that both Beepster and Razorwit placed on EQ indicate that it's the first thing to try.
 
One more tip: When I start a mix, I always start off with all the tracks centered, in mono. That makes it easier to EQ the tracks so they don't step on each other. Once I get a clean, distinct sound for each instrument in the mono mix, creating a stereo field opens up the mix like you wouldn't believe.

ROFL!1
 
Let's arm wrestle!!!
 
;-p
 
If it makes you feel any better I learned things and stuff from your post.

These are good suggestions that you're getting.  However, one quick fix that may help would be to create separate clips for those instruments in that section.  Then you can process the clips separately from the rest of the mix either by EQ or applying light compression to the clips.  When the section is over, you don't have to do anything else, and the parts will fall back into place.