Good question Kenny.
 

craigb
I'm FAR more comfortable with learning a DAW, but that makes sense; computers are my life.

What an excellent reflection of my own circumstances... My guitar and keyboard playing has certainly suffered over the years. Some peeps are "naturals," and can pick up an instrument, of any type, and start playing. Not the case with me.
 
And learning your DAW is just the start of it. Learning how to use your tools of choice, as well as learning about the intricacies of the frequency spectrum...
 
And the learning never stops!

BassDaddy

kennywtelejazz
Both learning activity's seem very necessary to bring one's own personal Music creation to the next level .... 
I've been wrestling with this one myself for a long while ....
I'm curious to hear how folks around here balance both learning curves  .
 
all the best ,
 
Kenny

Kenny, I would only add Songwriting to that equation. If you want to be a songwriter you have to be able to write them down. On paper or a recorder of some type. It's not a song until you can get it outside of you. It's a concept until then. If you could have exactly what you want, which side of the glass would you want to be on? If you write  songs that forces you to play stuff you can't play right now. So the song drives your playing and improving. Not just technique for it's own sake.

Yes BassDaddy, you have a very good idea there
 
When I started the thread , I was just trying to squeeze what I could place within the treads topic before it maxed out on the amount of letters and words  ....
As far as I'm concerned,  people can feel free to discus any topic or element of the various subjects they work on  musically in this thread...
Songwriting , practicing , learning the DAW, playing the guitar , becoming an engineer and balancing that with playing ....anything they want ....
 
I have worked with many Songwriters over the years (mostly back in the day ),
Some were very fluent and precise in what they could play and wanted in a song they were writing .
Some could barely hum their way out of a paper bag while banging a beat out on the side of a guitar with out even having the ability to play a chord on the guitar ...yet they could come up with a brilliant song ...
 
Since I'm not a singer , it made no difference to me whatsoever ...my role was to serve the song in anyway I could.
 
The people I have worked with have sought my help for melodies , additional lyrics , song arrangements , guitar parts for recording sessions and demos, solo guitar backing for small duet gigs ...membership in a band ...lot's of things ..to many to list here now....
 
IMHO , to do any of that as a valued contributing player ...You have to have chops
 
More than once I have worked with a very talented Artist that could write a mean song yet they couldn't play it or sing it right or worth a $hit ...
Sure they could strum it in the key of G on a guitar and sing it half a$$ed in that key while they are writing it ...
It's a whole other thing when I slap a capo on their guitar so they can strum it just like they did in G but now in Bb
Then they find out that they now have the right vocal range to be able to sing the song they wrote  in such a way as to bring the house down ....
 
When I get to do it ....the bulk of what I consider to be what I enjoy doing the most is playing live in front an audience ...
It's happened to me plenty of times when somebody has decided to change the key of a song right there on stage because they might have been dealing w a sore throat or a shot voice ....
You better believe I'm happy I got the tech and chops to be able to play my guitar in that key and think fast on my feet ....
 
it's all good , it's been nice talking w you ,
 
Kenny
 

Rain
 
Mastering your DAW requires intense commitment for a certain amount of time - then you simply need to work with it regularly and  just stay on top of things. 
 
An instrument is a different story.
 
I remember reading that story about cellist Pablo Casals and how he still spent 4 or 5 hours practicing every day when he was in his 80's. When asked why, he answered "Because I think I am making progress." To me, that sums it up.
 

Hi Rain , thanks for sharing  your quote here rang a bell ....
 

BassDaddy

kennywtelejazz
Both learning activity's seem very necessary to bring one's own personal Music creation to the next level .... 
I've been wrestling with this one myself for a long while ....
I'm curious to hear how folks around here balance both learning curves  .
 
all the best ,
 
Kenny

Kenny, I would only add Songwriting to that equation. If you want to be a songwriter you have to be able to write them down. On paper or a recorder of some type. It's not a song until you can get it outside of you. It's a concept until then. If you could have exactly what you want, which side of the glass would you want to be on? If you write  songs that forces you to play stuff you can't play right now. So the song drives your playing and improving. Not just technique for it's own sake.

I took your advice and changed the opening post ...thank you
 

Moshkito

kennywtelejazz
Hey Pedro ,
OK I looked at your pics ,
I see you have mixers and a bunch of other stuff ...that's all cool yet, a few quick questions ..
Do you have a proper audio interface / soundcard for audio that also does midi ? if you do what is it ...
...

 
The sound card on that machine is the Delta 1010LT ... which has so many ins and outs that you can't use? (Hehehehehe!!! Their software only allows one to be used!)
 
Audio interface ... a small cheapie, but otherwise none and not sure what I need to get.
 
 

OK Pedro , lets start here first ....
 
I have the same card in my XP computer ...The Delta 1010lt ...
I liked it very much , so much so that I also picked up an Audiophile 192 .....the 192 is still sitting in a box brand new until I figure out if and when what type of desktop I may get someday ....
 
The 1010lt is a fine card ....it is a little tricky to set up because if you want to monitor what you are playing you will need to run an external mixer from the main outs into a small mixer out to your monitors to be able to hear what you are recording in real time ....
You actually have 10 tracks mono , or 5 tracks stereo for both your inputs and outputs RCA style cable....
You also have midi in and midi out plus and optical interface ....
Judging by your pics, it is certainly more than enough to go pretty deep ....definitely  a lot deeper than you may have used the 1010lt  so far .....
 
IIFC, you mentioned you had ran Music Creator and Abelton in the past and the learning curve roughed you up a little bit ...
What full type of DAW music software do you have on the computer w the 1010lt ?
lets here some specs ...OS ? ...64 bit ? 32 bit ? and do you still have your DAW's / install disks ?
IMHO since that computer does have a decent sound card ..it may be a good place to start then once that is up to speed you can build up from there ....
BTW , I'm not suggesting that you should change every thing around if you like being like a small radio station 
I'm suggesting that we get you set up to be able to create in a DAW w a sound card proper  and then branch out from there ....
Another question , do you have a lap top ? if you do does it have any music software on it ?
I ask you that because I probably don't live much more that 15 miles away from you and if it's only a matter of getting unstuck w the DAW , I can probably meet up with you at a library or a  coffee house  
 
hang in there bro ...
 
all the best ,
 
Kenny

Hey Ken , thanks for offering to help out Pedro
 

bjornpdx
Seems like most of you here on this forum have been doing hands-on music since you were babies. I don't have that experience so I tend to hang back on posting anything, but the subject of this thread got me to thinking about things.

I suppose I'm not your typical DAW user. I know my way around a keyboard and guitar but only enough to pick out a melody. I've never been in a band (except playing clarinet in the high school marching band) and I've never been in a recording studio doing whatever those guys do.

Music has always been a source of bliss for me, so in the mid-80s I followed that bliss with an Atari 1040ST computer, an Ensonique ESQ-M synth, Dr T's sequencing program and proceeded to create my own songs, mostly by way of entering notes via MIDI.  And I have to admit that things haven't changed much since then except for the technology. Basically I play a melody line into Sonar then correct/expand it in PRV with MIDI.   So I know the MIDI capabilities of Sonar pretty well and that's how I play an instrument and for me it works pretty well. The main thing that's lacking is how it's played, the dynamics of it, which can be corrected in PRV as well, though it's laborious. 
 
I think about picking up the guitar lessons where I left off about ten years ago but then  reality sets in. I'm getting on in years and my fingers don't move as well as they used to. And it seems kind of pointless to try and attain a level of competency on an instrument at this point in my life that maybe I should have attained fifty years ago. I don't really need that skill anyway to accomplish what I want to do in music, which is to create a song that I like.

Hi Bjorn ,
 
Sure , I get where you are coming from , it's all good
 
Regarding the type of workflow  style you do .... that is  some pretty intricate stuff to be able to compose good sounding  sequenced music  using a computer ...
 
One time I sat in and watched one of the Composers from the Star Trek franchise score an episode of Star Trek Voyager ... Paul Baillargeon http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0047574/
 
Paul used to like to score some of  the episodes of Voyager he composed at my brother Kevin's place since he kept his gear at my brothers place and he hated staying in Hotels....
I found it very interesting to watch him that one time I was allowed to watch because he never even broke a sweat coming up with the music ...
As he was watching the episode on a moniter , he was playing a mid keyboard running an assortment of midi rack-mount moduals into some sort of computer while his assistant notated every thing he had come up with in the orchestral midi mock up ...
The very next day they went into the studio in L A and had a real orchestra play the score ...
I saw the show the following week on TV ....
Me personally , I would love to go there , yet I know I don't have the chops to pull that type of gig off
( today or maybe never )  I'm gonna stick to my guitar ...
Anyway , I got into the computer game pretty late in life . Right around the time I joined this forum ...
 
it's been nice talking with you ,
 
Kenny

Zargg
http://www.m-audio.com/support/drivers-search (this assuming you are using Win 7 SP1 X64) 
(If on newer Windows, try installing driver in compatibility mode)
...
 

W7 Pro X64 ... and it is/was up to date with all versions. I'll recheck the drivers, but even its little software appears to be very limited as far as i can tell.
 
I have not updated that machine to W10, probably because of that sound card. I have not seen support for it, and it is still being sold, meaning that it is probably OK, however, if the software it has does the same thing, there would be no improvements, maybe? I have a feeling that M-Audio likely thinks that with W8 and W10, the driver issue is not important?

Moshkito

Zargg
http://www.m-audio.com/support/drivers-search (this assuming you are using Win 7 SP1 X64) 
(If on newer Windows, try installing driver in compatibility mode)
...
 

W7 Pro X64 ... and it is/was up to date with all versions. I'll recheck the drivers, but even its little software appears to be very limited as far as i can tell.
 
I have not updated that machine to W10, probably because of that sound card. I have not seen support for it, and it is still being sold, meaning that it is probably OK, however, if the software it has does the same thing, there would be no improvements, maybe? I have a feeling that M-Audio likely thinks that with W8 and W10, the driver issue is not important?

The 1010LT software is somewhat limited, but quite usable for recording, playback and mixing. You can do loopbacks (cable in / out) for internal routing. IIRC it does not support very low latency.
I had mine for almost 10 years before I sold it, in almost mint condition. 
Win 7 was the last stable OS when using mine. So I would not upgrade if you do not have any use for Win 10.
I did not have issues using it in Win 7, at least.
Try installing the drivers in the link I provided, and choose ASIO drivers.
If it does not help, give me a shout.
All the best.

I currently have an injury that will prevent me from playing an instrument for the next few weeks (i.e. my thumb got trapped in a doorway). Fortunately I can still operate a mouse, so I can continue manipulating audio and midi. It's business as usual really.

Kev999
I currently have an injury that will prevent me from playing an instrument for the next few weeks (i.e. my thumb got trapped in a doorway). Fortunately I can still operate a mouse, so I can continue manipulating audio and midi. It's business as usual really.

I know how you feel
I broke my left ring finger approx 3 weeks ago, and am getting guitar withdrawals
Still able to operate a pc (barely).

Damn...  Now MY fingers hurt just thinking about it!  

synkrotron
Good question Kenny.
 

craigb
I'm FAR more comfortable with learning a DAW, but that makes sense; computers are my life.

What an excellent reflection of my own circumstances... My guitar and keyboard playing has certainly suffered over the years. Some peeps are "naturals," and can pick up an instrument, of any type, and start playing. Not the case with me.
 
And learning your DAW is just the start of it. Learning how to use your tools of choice, as well as learning about the intricacies of the frequency spectrum...
 
And the learning never stops!

Hi synkrotron ,
 
good post I like the last few sentences . They apply to my situation ....thank you .
 

Kev999
I currently have an injury that will prevent me from playing an instrument for the next few weeks (i.e. my thumb got trapped in a doorway). Fortunately I can still operate a mouse, so I can continue manipulating audio and midi. It's business as usual really.

Kev999 ,
 
Ouch , I hope you feel better soon...
 
Kenny