• SONAR
  • Is Sonar X3 Live-ready? (p.3)
2013/10/01 18:56:59
ActiveAxE
Thanks for all the answers, people... Currently since I've started using Sonar X2 I've been having minimal (only 1 or 2 that I can remember) dropouts in the audio engine. In a live situation I would definitely run Sonar X2 standalone and turn the color depth to 16-bit. My current interface is a Focusrite 2i2 running at 96 Khz - when I play through the device as I would live the latency is fine even without engaging the input monitoring - which is why I'd like to use Sonar as a tool for playing with VSTs and different FX chains live.

Thanks , for giving some technical info on the subject - I really do not have a budget to go to Ableton Live (I do have Live Lite but have not got into it); I've got things configured pretty much in X2 and if possible I'd like to stay there.

By the way guys, I don't plan (as of yet - I can't play keys) to use it to trigger VSTi's or MIDI/Audio Loops, besides maybe the occasional backing track...
2013/10/01 23:51:48
joden
Sanderxpander
Oh yes definitely. My typical songs consist of;
1. A bass track (audio)
2. A drums track (audio)
3. An extra drums track ( audio)
4. A harmony part track (audio)
5. Another harmony part track (audio)
6. Miscallaneous ( audio)
7. A live input for vocals ( fx type sounds)
8. Maschine (played and edited live, so midi)

Everything is pre split into sections/loops of course, so I can jump to the chorus or verse of a given song at any time, mix the bass in or out, etcetera. Keeping the track order between songs means I can select an entire song from the browser, plunk it in, and have roughly the same mix. While everything keeps playing. It's super flexible this way and I usually don't really need to edit midi synth parts while performing live ( I also play keys live), I tend to focus more on fx and mix, dj-ish.

Excellent SanderX - yep that's about the same methodology I envisaged - okly dokly time for me to actually install Live 9 and give it a SERIOUS go. I still have all my Sonar projects with all the separate wav tracks so transferring should be a doddle. Learning Live won't be, but reading how you are using it I will stick with it this time I think.
 
Thanks heaps for taking the time to explain it out.
 
Cheers
Dennis
2013/10/02 01:47:25
Sanderxpander
Enjoy. Live takes a little time to get used to but I'm sure you'll really enjoy it in the end.
Some useful beginner tips:
1. The TAB key switches between arrangement view/mode and session/clip mode. You'll want to use session/clip mode mostly, but it can be useful if you need to edit clips or loops to use arrangement mode. You can freely drag audio between the two by grabbing it and then pressing TAB.
2. Control+J bounces whatever you have selected to a clip.
3. Ccntrol+4 switches quantize on and off.
4. If you want to make sure a certain song or session always plays at a certain speed, simply add "xxxbpm" to the session launch box on the far right. Example: "Chorus A 120bpm"
5. To assign any parameter to a key or midi signal, press Control+K (for keyboard) or Control+M ( for midi), simply select the parameter with the mouse and press your key or move your midi controller. They're now linked.
6. Live, as a stability safeguard, does not automatically add midi controllers as you plug them in, nor will it recognize any that you plugged in while it was running. Plug in everything, then start up. The first time youmuse a new controller, you'll have to go into the preferences and set up whether you want to use it to send/receive clock, record and play notes/track or control the live interface (or any combination).
7. Get a dedicated controller if you are serious about using it live! ;) It really makes a huge difference when you can touch live like an instrument and feel the immediacy.
2013/10/02 02:09:55
joden
Thanks - I am cutting and pasting those tips to a tips log I have a feeling they will be very useful!
 
I have a Korg NanoPad 2 and a NanoKontrol2 so these should be okay for controllers. Probs the pad would be the better.
 
 
2013/10/02 02:18:31
Sanderxpander
Those nano's will get you started. I use an APC40 myself, which is probably overkill in the beginning. But it's definitely nice to have something to trigger both entire scenes as well as well as individual clips, and that lets you navigate around with up/down arrows.

I should have said Control+4 turns Snap to Grid on and off by the way :)
2013/10/02 05:13:57
harmony gardens
I used Sonar 7 live for quite a while.  It was Sampletank based for my sounds.  I use 3 keyboards live and set up a templet that routed one to channel 1, one to channel 2 and one to channel 3.  I then made combinations in Sampletank that I could access through the drop down menu that had the sounds I needed for a particular song.  I didn't actually do a lot of "fancy stuff". they were mostly bread and butter set ups.   I made up four files, one for each set, with the drum tracks for each song set to begin at a marker with the song title, along with a tempo map.  I could then use the marker drop down to find the beginning of the song and would use the Sampletank templet to change my sound set up.   I use patch changes to change the settings in my vocal plugs and just had my voice going through Sonar.
 
My bandmate (well, duo mate) had a direct line to the mixer with his voice and played his guitar through his amp.  We needed to use a separate mic input for him, so he could act as the front man if I needed to change Sampletank combi's, because it would make huge noises if I was changing combi's and my mic dropped out until it was loaded.  It wasn't perfect, but it worked for us.  I would only need to change files between sets.
 
I've been playing around in X2 to use this same system in the new computer (I'll be getting X3 in the next couple days).  I'm exicited because with the new machine (now in 64 bit, 4 core with 16 gigs of ram) I can load much more complex sounds and the mic doesn't drop out, and loading a Sampletank combi doesn't create any unwanted noise.  Everything is sooooooooooooooo much faster, too.  We've only done a few shows since I started moving into the new machine, but so far, so good.
 
I'm sure I will be able to do much more now that I actually have a computer that can handle a large load.  I'm looking to get something similar going with 24 bit sounds,,, etc. 
 
 
 
 
2013/10/02 05:39:23
ActiveAxE
Cool setup, harmonygardens! I think you answered my question. My use for it will be for guitars, but i can see how what you doing can apply to my situation. Thanks for adding in some info!
2013/10/02 06:32:51
harmony gardens
Glad it helped you, ActiveAxE.   I'm REALLY psyched about having the groove matrix built into Sonar.  I've been poking around with Live 8 Light, which I got with my Focusright 40, and it's nice, but with the groove matrix built into Sonar, now, I think we have most of what we need to make it work live with Sonar.  I prefer Sonar's workflow in general.  I don't know how fast a big file is going to load, but I'm pretty sure I could do a file per song, if I wanted.
 
Watch the dancing poodle while I change my file... lol
 
I think with Sonar now, you have the option of working in loop based creation through the groove matrix, and the familar landscape of a linar option, too.  It's like Project 5 and Sonar got married and had a superstud kid that's growing up before our eyes. 
 
 
ETA,,, one other thing that I'm able to do now is run Winamp in my taskbar and make playlists for music during breaks.  I can even play along with them in Sonar running them at the same time.  I'm in heaven,,,
2013/10/02 06:46:10
Sanderxpander
I don't mean to force anyone to use different software, I love Sonar and respect the idea to stick with one program, but I think you underestimate the workflow of Ableton in a live situation.
That said, if you can get what you want then don't change a winning team :)
2013/10/02 06:54:27
harmony gardens
I'll keep an open mind, Sander.  :)  I am not done exploring it.  Going from Sonar 7 with a gig of RAM is making me giddy in Sonar X2.  I feel like I just woke up in a new century after being asleep. 
 
 
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