Anyone knows if this works?
 
Recording guitar directly into MOTU Ultralite MK3,
Having the signal in through to a singel output. like channel 7.
Then from channel 7 to the output on the MOTU ZBox.
from the input on the MOTU ZBox to the input on my Bugera Trirec.
 
Anyone tried this?
 

Hey, dood. How are ya?
 
I don't think the ZBox is designed to do that... although I sure it will but to what results I do not know. What you'd want in that scenario is a "Reamping" box.
 
Essentially the ZBox is designed to take direct signal from a guitar and pretend it's the "preamp" section of a guitar amp so you can plug it into a mixing board line input (or line in on an interface). By putting it on the output of your interface you are feeding it a "line level" signal. I'm not sure what would occur in that setup but it defeats the purpose of the unit.
 
A reamping box would take that line output from your interface (or mixer) and turn it back into an instrument level output (like the output from your guit). So you can take a dry DI track from your DAW/interface and send it "line out" to your amp. The box coverts the line level signal back into what a guitar would normally output to an amplifier input.
 
I'm guessing you probably know this stuff but it's worth mentioning. Also I'm not sure if the ZBox might get damaged by feeding it line level signals.
 
So reamping is what you want for sending line out from your mixer/interface to an amp input BUT there are nice regular DI Boxes/Splitters on the market that will take your dry guit signal and send it to your MOTU Instrument input and a second output to your amp designed specifically for electric guitar (as opposed to just bass which is a more common DI box because of live sound applications).
 
I've looked at all sorts of these types of devices to see what I need to make my input better. Just a matter of scrounging up some money to acquire them. However in the meantime I've just been using what I have around as far as hardware and really twisting up my amp sims.
 
Personally I think you've been getting some good guit tones from your amp and your sims. I wouldn't worry TOO much about this type of crap for your style. Toss the ZBox in front of the MOTU and use your sims and/or record your amp with mics until you can get a nice reamping box/electric guitar DI splitter box).
 
Also you could/should be recording "doubles" for your rhtyhm guits so you could use the DI recording through the ZBox and sims with live mic recording through the amp as the double track. Might be cool.
 
Cheers!

Presumably the ZBox is just a transformer. If you connect it backwards you risk burning it up, depending.
 
And the impedances wouldn't be right anyway, because the input impedance of the ZBox would be far higher than a guitar puts out.
 
The "easy" solution is if you already have some sort of FX device that will accept line level inputs that isn't true bypass so that it buffers the signal even when bypassed.

I might get a re-amp box then. I want to use my Bugera amp, and sims. But edit the tracks before getting the real sound.

Jarsve
I might get a re-amp box then. I want to use my Bugera amp, and sims. But edit the tracks before getting the real sound.

Yup. Definitely a reamp box then. I'd imagine using the ZBox on the input into the interface as well would make the reamped signal eaven better for the amp. Don't know though.
 
Cheers!

my instruments input on my MOTU isn't that bad.

Beepster

Jarsve
I might get a re-amp box then. I want to use my Bugera amp, and sims. But edit the tracks before getting the real sound.

I'd imagine using the ZBox on the input into the interface as well would make the reamped signal eaven better for the amp. Don't know though.
 
Cheers!

From a technical standpoint if the input impedance is already high enough then adding transformers or whatnot can only add coloration, which might or might not be desirable.

drewfx1
From a technical standpoint if the input impedance is already high enough then adding transformers or whatnot can only add coloration, which might or might not be desirable.

I think you know more about this stuff than I do but my hypothetical reasoning is something like this (and sorry if I get some of the technical terms incorrect).
 
The input jack/preamp of an amplifier has a capacitor(?) that takes the output from the guitar input and turns it into a 1000ohm(?) signal before it hits any of the processing (EQ/distortion/etc) and eventually the power amp section of the guit amp. That 1000ohm(?) signal is ideal for guitar. The circuitry in the ZBox supposedly mimics/uses the same input circuitry of a nice Fender amp.
 
The "Instrument/Hi-Z" input of an interface is designed to take guit signals but also bass/keyboards (not line out but maybe not suited for a guitar amp input). So it's more versatile than the preamp of a guit amp or the ZBox but maybe not the exact impedance you want for a guitar signal. Some interface's Instrument ins may or may not have been designed to be ideal for guitars is my point. I think MOTU supposedly do this well (and designed the ZBox so maybe that tech is built in to some or all of their units). Focusrite seems to do well in this regard too (which is what I own).
 
The ZBox supposedly eliminates even having to worry about the quality of the HiZ/Instrument input and allows you to plug into a line level input... like on a mixer. So I think you just don't engage the HiZ option on the input of the interface (dunno but it's supposed to work on mixers so that would make sense).
 
So using the ZBox on input into Sonar would be like recording what the preamp on a Fender amp is hearing before it hits the effects/power amp section. Therefore in theory what gets recorded is that same sound and will respond much better once it hits an amp sim program (which of course has none of that hardware circuitry) or even gets sent to a reamp box and out to a real amp.
 
The question becomes does ACTUALLY recording that ZBox output then feeding that recording through the reamp box into the amp provide a more realistic representation of the pure guitar output once it hits the amp? Like does the design of the reamp box (which is supposed to take a line signal) ruin the efforts of the ZBox upon input somehow (perhaps make it sound worse)?
 
I've often wondered this about sims as well. Since many people don't actually use things like a ZBox I'd imagine the sim makers have attempted to work with a standard DI HiZ signal to create their sounds. Example GR2 and even 4 were almost unusable to me because of "fizziness" and the need to endlessly tweak/correct it. GR5 and TH2 seem much better able to handle a plain old HiZ signal while maintaining realism. Did they program around such input signals to acheive this?
 
Hopfully that makes sense. It just seems like there are so many variables that it becomes a moving target.
 
Meh... understanding finicky electronics stuff is a bit above my paygrade. lol
 
;-)

Short answer - a guitar amp has a high impedance input which keeps the higher-than-line-level impedance signal of a (passive) guitar from losing signal (especially high frequencies) from loading. If you plug a (passive) guitar/bass into an input with too low of an input impedance it's similar to turning down the volume on the guitar - some of your signal, especially high frequencies, goes to ground.
 
A direct box, whether passive transformer based or active, presents a high impedance input for the guitar and a suitable output impedance.
 
But if you already have a high enough input impedance (like 1 M Ohm), you aren't losing anything so there's no problem to be solved. OTOH some "instrument" inputs on some interfaces do have a lower input impedance (500 k ohm or less) than desirable for a passive guitar/bass and can benefit. 
 
And of course, if there aren't any "instrument" inputs then you will absolutely need one of these devices.

Beepster

drewfx1
From a technical standpoint if the input impedance is already high enough then adding transformers or whatnot can only add coloration, which might or might not be desirable.

I think you know more about this stuff than I do but my hypothetical reasoning is something like this (and sorry if I get some of the technical terms incorrect).
 
The input jack/preamp of an amplifier has a capacitor(?) that takes the output from the guitar input and turns it into a 1000ohm(?) signal before it hits any of the processing (EQ/distortion/etc) and eventually the power amp section of the guit amp. That 1000ohm(?) signal is ideal for guitar. The circuitry in the ZBox supposedly mimics/uses the same input circuitry of a nice Fender amp.
 
The "Instrument/Hi-Z" input of an interface is designed to take guit signals but also bass/keyboards (not line out but maybe not suited for a guitar amp input). So it's more versatile than the preamp of a guit amp or the ZBox but maybe not the exact impedance you want for a guitar signal. Some interface's Instrument ins may or may not have been designed to be ideal for guitars is my point. I think MOTU supposedly do this well (and designed the ZBox so maybe that tech is built in to some or all of their units). Focusrite seems to do well in this regard too (which is what I own).
 
The ZBox supposedly eliminates even having to worry about the quality of the HiZ/Instrument input and allows you to plug into a line level input... like on a mixer. So I think you just don't engage the HiZ option on the input of the interface (dunno but it's supposed to work on mixers so that would make sense).
 
So using the ZBox on input into Sonar would be like recording what the preamp on a Fender amp is hearing before it hits the effects/power amp section. Therefore in theory what gets recorded is that same sound and will respond much better once it hits an amp sim program (which of course has none of that hardware circuitry) or even gets sent to a reamp box and out to a real amp.
 
The question becomes does ACTUALLY recording that ZBox output then feeding that recording through the reamp box into the amp provide a more realistic representation of the pure guitar output once it hits the amp? Like does the design of the reamp box (which is supposed to take a line signal) ruin the efforts of the ZBox upon input somehow (perhaps make it sound worse)?
 
I've often wondered this about sims as well. Since many people don't actually use things like a ZBox I'd imagine the sim makers have attempted to work with a standard DI HiZ signal to create their sounds. Example GR2 and even 4 were almost unusable to me because of "fizziness" and the need to endlessly tweak/correct it. GR5 and TH2 seem much better able to handle a plain old HiZ signal while maintaining realism. Did they program around such input signals to acheive this?
 
Hopfully that makes sense. It just seems like there are so many variables that it becomes a moving target.
 
Meh... understanding finicky electronics stuff is a bit above my paygrade. lol
 
;-)

I cant say this for sure, I didn't find any confirmation now. But i think the reason why their not selling the ZBox anymore is that it is built into their instrument inputs. So the UltraLite MK3 and after got this built in.
 
Anyway. I only use EMG active. So my signal is much stronger out of my guitars. The ZBox is only a ohm changer. Doesn't add anything more. You can call it a passive DI.