mike_mccue
 
I've started wondering when Cakewalk will tell us that SONAR X will only install on Win8. When that happens I'm going to disconnect from the train. I hope X3 works on Win7. I hope I use it. I'm going to be bummed if it turns out to be a X2b+ stop gap meant as a holdover before the app goes Win8 touch centric in the next couple of years.

 
I had not thought of that. If I have to go to W8... I am OUT. I will NOT buy a new OS in order to run Sonar.
 

mike_mccue
I've been using ProTools 11 native and it is fantastic. I never took the PT LE stuff seriously but the native stuff is rocking on my new DAW.

 
I have been thinking about this too. I really don't want to spend the money on it and am put off by hearing that my Octa-Capture will not work with PT but the upside is, and this is only my opinion, I think that maybe Sonar is moving more toward electronic music and looping.. and touchDAW, toward a younger market of people who are not musicians but who want to make music... while PT and a couple of others are more focused on audio recording. That is important to me. I need soft synths and drum programs but I am most concerned with audio recording. OF course I could be completely wrong... 
 
 

mike_mccue
I'm ready to get it over with. Spending a couple K on PT, Studio One, and very soon Cubase 7 wasn't in the plans... but that's what happened when SONAR X left me wanting a program that reminded me of the best features in SONAR 8.5 Classic Edition.
 
I want to get back to spending my budget on nice microphones and tracking nice sounds with the comfort of knowing the DAW is just what I've hoped for these past two decades.

 
 
I hear you. I don't have the budget right now for PT 11, S1, and Cubase 7 (plus what I've read about C7, it scares me... but heck, can it really be that hard to learn.. that may be an indicator that it is a really great piece of work).
 
Someone said somewhere that at least with PT one has a sense of security. That is becoming more and more important, at least to me. I have not been worried about the future of Sonar but I am beginning to get just a little anxious, I still expect it to be good but little things like what you said... if it requires W8... that will be a game changer for me, I will not be forced into W8 or touch, even if it is what I want, I will resent being pushed into it and wont go along and if they move any farther away from audio recording, I will be looking around instead of dropping more money here.
 

mike_mccue
best regards,
mike

Good post Mike...
 
Julien

meh

Jlien X
Thanks for your feedback.
Point 1: Doesn't that mean that even those who don't understand computers can use Studio One, etc.and isn't that a good thing?
Point 2: Sorry, my English isn't good. I wanted to mean that you can't sell your Sonar to someone. 
 

Point 1 Apples and Oranges.  Just becaue 1 piece of sofware works well on one platform does not mean that another similar piece of software will work the same way on the same platform.
Point 2.  For the same reasons that technically I can't sell some one a (You name the artist here) song.  The artist or in this respect Roland ownes the intellectual copyright on Sonar.

 
To clarify my points...

Point 1: I often hear people say Sonar doesn't work on their computers while other daws like S1, Reaper, Live, Cubase all work. Isn't it natural to think that Sonar is indeed unstable on many computers and shouldn't it be improved if Cakewalk wants more people to use the program?

Point 2: You can't put your Sonar on the Buy & Sell section.

mike_mccue
I still think SONAR 8.5 Classic Edition was the best all arounder Audio and MIDI DAW ever.
 
Just a few little fixes that had been on the Cakewalk Do list for about 10 years and it would have been 99% there.
 
I used it for 8 hours yesterday and it still feels fresh. I had Fabfilter stuff on everything and it just works great for me.
 
Every time I look at SONAR X I think it looks like it was made to seem like Home Studio on steroids with an emphasis on drag and drop loop convenience.
 
It's hard to take Pro Channel seriously when you prefer to use top of the field dsp. The claim that independent efx gui windows is confusing cracks me up. Seriously. I think it's funny.
 
The audio tracking features have been downgraded with a clumsy use of display space. The elimination of layers and the crude adoption of lanes defied the acknowledgement that SONAR's layers were one of it's most powerful features... a feature that set it apart and above more popular DAWs like Pro Tools.
 
The friendly names audio input debacle is still a sad, sad joke. All the other DAWs do it the right way while SONAR users explain that never having "input 2" listed as "input 2" is not a big deal. Seriously. I think it's sad. 
 
I think SONAR's drum maps are really sweet. I think they are the best, but I haven't tried Cubase in a while.
 
I'm planning on buying SONAR X3 before I see what Cakewalk did to it. I'm going to approach it like I'm taking a swim at the North Pole. Pinch my nose and jump.
 
I've started wondering when Cakewalk will tell us that SONAR X will only install on Win8. When that happens I'm going to disconnect from the train. I hope X3 works on Win7. I hope I use it. I'm going to be bummed if it turns out to be a X2b+ stop gap meant as a holdover before the app goes Win8 touch centric in the next couple of years.
 
I've been using ProTools 11 native and it is fantastic. I never took the PT LE stuff seriously but the native stuff is rocking on my new DAW.
 
I still like to work in SONAR 8.5 Classic Edition because it has great MIDI tools and the audio works great but I've developed a plan to use less and less MIDI so as to make the most of Pro Tools audio production strengths because it feels like Cakewalk has simply abandoned any efforts to get to 99% and has decided to give away free stuff instead of servicing their top of the line product.
 
I'm ready to get it over with. Spending a couple K on PT, Studio One, and very soon Cubase 7 wasn't in the plans... but that's what happened when SONAR X left me wanting a program that reminded me of the best features in SONAR 8.5 Classic Edition.
 
I want to get back to spending my budget on nice microphones and tracking nice sounds with the comfort of knowing the DAW is just what I've hoped for these past two decades.
 
best regards,
mike
 
 

Mike,
 
Excellent post, pretty well sums up my current state as well.   Though I bought X1 and X2, not a fan of the X workflow.   I find X2, not unusable, but certainly unpredictable as it frequently white-screens on my system.   Honestly, not interested in figuring out why, X1 is working fine as a stop gap.  Currently using 8.5.3 for MIDI and X1 64-bit for final audio mixing.    I too plan to jump on the X3 bandwagon but certainly have some contingency plans if it doesn't meet expectations.   The only thing I would add to your list is VST3 support.
 
Regards

If you cant 'Beat Em', 'Bash Em'

wetdentist
i am the "fanboi" they let loose on.  kvr is a place that is no friend to Cakewalk.  but just try saying negative things about Fruity Loops, and you will feel the wrath of the Image-Line people and their minions.

Good to you see you here.   However, I must point out that your positive outlook on SONAR is completely out of touch with reality and will be dealt with using the harshest means available.   
 
It would be great if every user had the same positive experience with SONAR X2 (or the X series in general), but that is and will not be the case.  I'm just glad I'm in that category.  But as someone mentioned previously, at the end of the day it's one's own personal experience that matters most, empathy and community aside. 
 

I am an ex IT guy, stepped away from the business in 2002. That's means I am 11 years out of date, which in turn means I am as clueless as any first time computer user.
 
I built my first PC in 1991, specs below.
 
I have had a few bad apps over the years, but Sonar/Cakewalk isn't one of them. In fact, just about everything I install...works. I currently run a network composed of 16 nodes, a mix of routers, PCs, laptop and desktop, Android devices, and printers. I have a ton of software and apps installed, and...
 
 
Everything works.
 
I open the shrinkwrap, stuff the disk in the drive, let the software make most of its own choices, and everything works. I bought used machines, new machines, built my own, and most combinations there-of. Factory installed OS and self partitioned, self installed OS.
 
Everything works.
 
I don't do code, reverse engineer, tweak, cuss, pull hair, none of it.
 
Install what I need and everything works.
 
I lost two networks, in 22 years, to virus/security issues, know what I did wrong, and don't do that anymore. (WebOS Palm Pixi brought down one, Win2K server in the DMZ killed the other.
 
Other than that, everything works.
 
I call Support from time to time. Twice with the network in its current config. Once to authorize a series of IK products, once to install and authorize and East West product.
 
I have to admit...I wonder just what these people do to their machines to get them so far out of whack. Actually...I suspect I already know, having had to fix several for friends.
 
Free games, free applications, free toolbars, free antivirus, free pron, free screensavers, and free plugins...
 
...ain't free.
 
Cheap junk...
 
...doesn't work.
 
You can buy a truckload of $100 two year old servers, and every one will have problems. The ones that don't are still running, in the corporation that dumped the problem children to the wholesaler.
 
Walmart software, you know, the substitute for Autocad that does everything Autocad does, for $49.95, doesn't work.
 
That Mitsumimikaka DVD writer that costs half what a Sony does...doesn't work.
 
Those one thousand free games you downloaded from XYZ Downloads.com...actually work just fine. Not the game parts. those don't work...the parts that work are the parts you aren't supposed to see, that open back doors, sell your information, download ads without your consent, install more screwed up games, etc. etc.
 
Figure out what you want the box to do.
 
Search online and see what the professionals who do that use. hardware and software.
 
Search for the hardware/software combination you are considering, with the keyword "Problem".
 
Not going into OS install today.
 
Fire up your new box, go directly to MS and patch it to date.
 
Install a recognized security app, and patch it to date.
 
Again and again and again, until it says No New Updates available.
 
Turn off auto-everything.
 
Install your apps.
 
If you hang it on the net, patch it to date once a month, manually, paying ATTENTION to what the patches say they are going to do.
 
Try to avoid major upgrades to major components of the OS or apps. If a doctor says he can rip out half YOUR brain, and replace it, and it will work better, don't believe HIM either.
 
Unhook the ethernet cable or turn off wireless, except on your network boxes.
 
Place a hardware router between your netboxs and your core (non-internet) machines. Place a hardware router between your entire LAN and the internet.
 
Back up the network once a month. Do NOT use ANY backup program. Copy files from source to target. Backup programs compress, and set flags, that YOU don't know enough to trust. When a backup completes you are NOT done. You have NO BACKUP until you COPY THREE FILES FROM BACKUP MEDIA TO HARDDRIVE AND OPEN THEM.
 
SUCCESSFULLY.
 
Keep boneheads off your critical machines. People that think "free" means "free" are boneheads. Use passwords, and firewalls. Put boneheads on standalone machines, or get them their own pipe to the net. If you have to hang boneheads on your network, put as many walls between them and you as you can. If even ONE machine is infested with Freeware, expect ALL of them to be infested soon.
 
If it works....if it does what you paid for it to do, LEAVE IT ALONE. Do NOT upgrade OS, do NOT upgrade major apps, do NOT retask machines that fill a specific need that ARE FILLING IT NOW. Buy a new one, with a plan in mind, research the plan, execute the plan, and do NOT take the old machine out of production until the new one is doing EVERYTHING you used the old one for for at least 3 months.
 
If it doesn't work....note exactly when it failed. If it has probs when the only thing on it is the OS...guses where your problem lies, and guess where your problem will STILL lie. after you bury it with quality applications.
 
If it works fine thru Sonar install, fine with Ozone install, and starts crashing when you install Joe's free, super plug, you downloaded off Azzwarez.com, guess where the problem is.
 
This doesn't seem that complicated to me.
 
I'm not real sure why it does to some.
 
Or maybe I am.
 
;-)

mike_mccue
 
I've started wondering when Cakewalk will tell us that SONAR X will only install on Win8. When that happens I'm going to disconnect from the train. I hope X3 works on Win7. I hope I use it. I'm going to be bummed if it turns out to be a X2b+ stop gap meant as a holdover before the app goes Win8 touch centric in the next couple of years.

Win 8 market penetration has been extremely disappointing for Microsoft.  I not only absolutely believe that X3 will be W7 compatible, I'd bet money that X5 will be (assuming one major SONAR release a year).

I bought the Win8 upgrade during the initial sale but have yet to install it.  Win7 is working well that I just haven't felt inspired to spend the time to upgrade, even though I already have it.   Now, if someone wants to take me up on that free touch screen offer, I'd be happy to upgrade asap and give it a try.   
 

@Jay Tee 4303
 
Bless your heart.  I feel the same way about a lot of the above.  I work with 64-bit only whenever possible, have supported plugins, drivers and hardware, have a patch-current PC that nobody else on the planet gets to play with, and Sonar X2a has never crashed once.
 
While there are indeed things that need patching, most have workarounds, and that's that.
 
I truly empathize with folks that have bugs for which there are not currently any workarounds.  Even there, some of that may be giant PITA things , more than things that prevent any productivity.  I have some frustrations with both staff view and step sequencer, and those issues do not seem to affect enough folks to where they get patched - but for my situation those things are frustrations and not show stoppers.
 
I am not aware of any total show stoppers that are global - meaning they affect the general user base for X2a.  I think that for the most part, when folks DO have crashes, if they post the details in a thread and give the forum community opportunity to resolve, most times things end up getting resolved, and are rarely found to be fault with Sonar.
 
I also see that at times folks either complain but do not provide detail, or they quote other posts where folks had complained - and take those complaints as factual cases of faults with Sonar, when upon closer examination many times those are either cases where detailed analysis was not done, or are otherwise baseless.
 
That's my take on it.
 
Bob Bone
 
 

The fact is, dozens, maybe hundreds of these people you two are pointing fingers at and accusing of being less competent than your own grandiose selves can run the very same projects on Reaper and Studio One all day long with out a hiccup.
 
It is that easy.
 
The finger pointing is not appreciated... and make no mistake, I just think it's in poor taste... my SONAR install works 99.99% rock solid, so I know you are not speaking about me. :-)
 
I am simply insulted that some of you guys think that insulting other people is a demonstration of your friendly and helpful nature.
 
Well done.
 
best regards,
mike
 
 
 
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