karma1959


Are you using 'entire mix' under export options?  If so, that sums the track / bus outputs together I believe - which would  change levels, given some tracks route to busses and others don't.  

If all tracks and busses route to a master bus, select 'audio output' (or something like that - I can't remember the exact semantics and I'm not at my DAW right now) under export options.  That should give you exactly what you're hearing from the master bus output.

Hope that helps.
Russ

This is the best answer so far - the entire problem sounds to me like a combination of improper routing & Export Options.


You MUST make sure every track is routed either to your Master Buss (Created by you) or indirectly via a sub-buss.


Choosing Main Outs under Source Category, Stereo under Channel Format, 44100 Sample Rate, Bit Depth of 32, Set Dithering to NONE.

Check everything under "Mix Enables" - you might need to uncheck Fast Bounce if you have BFD as your drum source (Also make sure that in the BFD gui you select "Offline")

Once you've completed the export, Import the Stereo Wave back into the project on a new track. Route this track directly to your Soundcard outputs (to avoid doubling up any master buss processing)

Now you can easily A/B between the mix & the export to prove they are identical.

  Slightly off-topic, but it has been the casue of the problem described in this thread for me on a few occasions.

Sometimes, for some reason I cannot understand, in some projects, when I click "Add a new audio track", the audio track that is created has some "crazy" routing given to it by Sonar (for instance instead of defaulting to "master", it goes to a random bus).

when I fail to notice that, it does affect the mixing process and bounces.

If I am doing somehting wrong, I'd love to know... or is it a Sonar quirk?

Have you tried exporting it at 44.1KHz and 16 bit? That would eliminate the codec that your player is using as a problem. What are you using as a WAV file player? I don't think Windows Media Player will play 96KHz/24 bit WAVs. 

vinny199


  Slightly off-topic, but it has been the casue of the problem described in this thread for me on a few occasions.

Sometimes, for some reason I cannot understand, in some projects, when I click "Add a new audio track", the audio track that is created has some "crazy" routing given to it by Sonar (for instance instead of defaulting to "master", it goes to a random bus).

when I fail to notice that, it does affect the mixing process and bounces.

If I am doing somehting wrong, I'd love to know... or is it a Sonar quirk?

 
 
I've seen this too, but not sure I have seen it in a while.  Because of that I always double check the routing every time I insert a track.
 
John

This is great stuff, guys. Exactly what I needed to get a better understanding on the Export feature.

@daveny... Surprisingly WMP did actually play my 24 bit 96k track. They must have improved it in the latest versions because I remember only a few years ago that I had to export down to 16/44k. 

@Jonesey... I'll take another look at my routing but I'm pretty sure everything was being sent to their corresponding busses and then out to the Master. However just changing the export settings seems to have worked. 

Sometimes, for some reason I cannot understand, in some projects, when I click "Add a new audio track", the audio track that is created has some "crazy" routing given to it by Sonar (for instance instead of defaulting to "master", it goes to a random bus).

New tracks are assigned to go to whatever is the default bus assigned in that project. You most likely have a different default set for some projects. Click on the bus you want and assign it as the default, then all new tracks will go to that.

Beepster


 

Anyway... I notice that for some reason the stereo interleave on all of my tracks except for the BFD tracks and one of my three bass tracks is turned off. I did not turn them off. I just inserted the tracks normally and they must have defaulted to that. WTH? They are mono tracks. My rhythm guitar tracks (the ones that are getting eaten) are panned hard right and left (two tracks). I'm thinking this may be the problem but now I'm worried if I turn them on it's going to completely change the sound and I'll have to redo the whole mix... after ACHING over it for far too long. Ugh... 

Anyone got some input here? 

You can make any mono track stereo simply highlighting the clip. Then just right clicking on the clip and selecting convert to stereo. This will make your clip a stereo clip.


I have had similar problems with export functions. Sonar X2 has greatly improved this believe it or not. In the past instead of just exporting the song I would highlight all the tracks and select bounce to tracks. This can be found in the clip pane menu. click on tracks then click on bounce to tracks.


This makes a stereo mix within Sonar on one stereo track. Then I select solo and listen. If I like the mix then I will master from that point using Ozone or what ever mastering effects I want. Then from there I export.


I have seen you have resolved the issue already. Thats good. Just trying to present further exporting ideas to try in the future

Thanks Noel & John,

I'll check this out. maybe a bus became the "default by accident". I certainly never set it out this way intentionally.

I'll look into it.

Thanks for the advice

Not sure how old this post is but I wanted to chime in on thoughts why things disappear when exported out to a wav or mp3. I have found that mixing in mono is very important to keep your levels consistent. The reason things seem to disappear is because either the space they are Eq'd to is competing with something else drowning it out, something is out of phase with another track or the stereo separation is too wide and/or the asymmetry is incorrect for the space it was eq'd to. Mixing in mono will allow you to hear everything without the separation and at whatever level it is at before you export the file to a stereo wav. If it is going to disappear, it is going to disappear in mono first. this was a hard lesson I learned the hard way because before I learned to mono mix before stereo, I sent a song I did to a local radio station and when it was broadcast the guitars were non existent in the mix.......thus a friend who owns a studio and lots of Google look ups pointed me into the mono mix thing first. It has made a world of difference in everything I produce now.  
 
Try this, uncheck every single stereo button and make sure the master fader is mono. Level every track into your busses and then listen through your master fader by soloing it. You should be able to hear everything like it was coming out of a single TV speaker (which by the way works excellent for mixing in mono).  Mono will expose flaws in stereo separation, levels and even eq.
 
Another thing to think about is if the tracks you produce get played on FM radio, played in a club, live on stage chances are it will be broadcast in mono. If an FM station goes out of range it will automatically switch the signal to mono. PA systems are 99% mono in clubs and live stage. So this is why mono is important to mix.  
 
So hopefully this helps. 

My WAV file mixes always sound exactly the same as the mix in Sonar so you shouldn't be having this problem. What are you listening to the WAV file on? If its Windows Media Player, make sure none of the SRS or EQ effects are on. Other players may have EQ or effects too. Also, many players cannot handle 24 bit WAV files or 96K WAV files. 
 
The real test would be importing the WAV file into a new Sonar project and listening to it there on the same speakers as the CWP file. It should sound exactly the same.