ORIGINAL: michael japan

I did like the EMU Ultra Series Sampler (which was actually an Ensoniq engine after the companies merged

Emu samplers have always been EMu inside, there's no Ensoniq in there. The requirement to use a card for the Emulator X is essentially a copy protection scheme.

ORIGINAL: Skyline_UK

I've tried softsynths like Hypersonic 2 and Bandstand and got tired wrestlng with the damn things. I think I was just lazy and wanted to do everything on one screen - Sonar, soft synths, the lot. But I spent 95% of the time faffing about with audio settings, frozen applications, unknown conflicts and all the other cr*p you get with bloody computers. I've seen the error of my ways and am now concentrating on working with - and learning - my brand new Roland Fantom X6. It's connected to Sonar via my midi interface and NEVER glitches. They play together perfectly. I'm back to making music again. If you can afford it - go for a hardware synth every time.

hmmmmmmmm. ..........

well I've got a FantomS, and in another room, I've got an X8...... there are still so many things I wish they'd do, that would make them more like Softsynths....

For instance, I compose a lot in Sonar.... It would be nice, if I had a VST interface like the TI has, where the exact settings I use can be recalled from the project file...... instead of me having to write a note, saying which patch I used, or which Performance.... Then I'd be free to manage my performances/patches, independant of any project that currently sits unfinished on my hard disk.

I also only have 4 audio outputs on the FantomS, and the X8, and my XV5050.... So when it comes time to record the Audio, I'm having to do the realtime recording/muting thing in several passes.... with VSampler, I push a couple of buttons, and it's done.

The main thing I hate about VSTis....... DXis.... is that with everything powered down, I have to start up the computer, Start Sonar, then Start my softsynth, then select the patches/instruments I want to use. Alot of that is solved, by leaving my DAW on all the time........ I'm OK with that...... and setting up a Normal.cwt for the way I work, so it seems like I'm just starting Sonar...... I'm okay with that as well. So for me, those problems have been solved.

The next thing I hate about softsynths, is that I have to stop what I'm doing click, scroll, wait for instrument to load....... etc.... where with my Rolands, patches load automatically...... and the tactile experience is more gratifying. I especially like how I can select a bass patch, work out a part, then go scroll through, and here how other patches work over a looped part... if I decide to keep the original patch, I just hit the exit button, and it's still there. It doesn't really work that way on a computer.

Now, I'm not too big on synths to begin with. The FM7, Pro52, and B4 saves me a lot of space, and gets me what I need(want).......


One thing, however, I can't ever see me doing is getting rid of my FantomS in favor of a straight up midi controller. It's nice to have the option of getting on with making music, without the computer stuff....... and it's a snap to transfer a midi project over to Sonar to really flesh it out.

I haven't heard everything that is out there, but I am qualified to day the following:

1) I have found that sample-based software-synthesizers sound at least as good as sample-based hardware counterparts.

2) I have KDLE, a Wavestation AD, a Wavestation SR, and a Lynx sound card. The sound of KDLE Wavestation is virtually indistinguishable from the hardware counterparts.

3) I also have an M1REX. KDLE M1 sounds more clear than the hardware counterpart.

4) I also have a SE Omega 8 and Arturia MMV. The SE Omega 8 sounds DRAMATICALLY SUPERIOR to the MMV. I have tried duplicating patches between the two, and this observation still stands. The Omega 8 sounds DRAMATICALLY SUPERIOR to my Nord Mudular, also, again, when patches are duplicated as closely as possible, and in any other circumstance. How does the Omega 8 sound better? In any way that you can imagine. However, its architecture is limited compared to SW synthesizers, and it requires occasional (automated) tuning.

5) Then, there are SW synthesizers that are not sample-playback, and are not virtual emulations (e.g. Cube 2) that stand on their own, and are beyond the scope of this post.

So, the conclusion that I live by is that sample-based SW synthesizers sound as good as hardware, but this does not hold true for actual analog synthesis and emulation, unfortunately.

Keith

ORIGINAL: WhyBe

ORIGINAL: Rain

...Besides, I really don't think it's matter of CPU - some people run softsynths like Reaktor on a dedicated machine, building the most compex/uncompromising synths one could imagine.

I'm going to check out Reaktor. Is this thing "quick" as a hardware synth though?

Between softsamplers, which offer possibilities well beyond what you could dream of w/ hardware based units, and softsynths, which allow you to access mostly every classic synth or then to create any conceivable sound - from good old moog basslines to the most authentic piano samples that can be found - pretty much every thing is covered.

A sample is not playing the real thing, of course. Especially when you introduce trying to control the sound in a similar way that the actual machine is controlled.

Make sure you check out tassman 4 and luxonix purity too. As for me i get what i want out of software synths i own and thats whats important. As long as i have the tools that lets me know i can compete with anyone regardless to what rig they have i'm doing just fine. And the tools that let me realize my ideas as well as offer inspiration i'm cool.It takes awhile to find the right tools for self,one just has to go over the market with a fine tooth comb.As for emulation of certain modern synths i'm not big on this anyhow, i just look for tools that sound great whether its a innacurate copycat or something totally original.Actually my greater preference lies in originality.It is'nt the softwares job to stick to emulating hardware especially since the future is theirs. SSL and many other large companies read the writing on the wall, thats why we have duende and many other products by big companies here in our virtual world.Triton, korg and yamaha i'm sure are'nt fools they know who the market is being driven by more and more as time passes by.I'm sure their doing deep thinking on this matter all the time now.

ORIGINAL: thunderkyss

well I've got a FantomS, and in another room, I've got an X8...... there are still so many things I wish they'd do, that would make them more like Softsynths....

For instance, I compose a lot in Sonar.... It would be nice, if I had a VST interface like the TI has, where the exact settings I use can be recalled from the project file...... instead of me having to write a note, saying which patch I used, or which Performance.... Then I'd be free to manage my performances/patches, independant of any project that currently sits unfinished on my hard disk.

You could always use the Sys Ex view in Sonar to dump your hardware synth state into your Sonar project. This way your hardware can be recalled to its exact state as when you were working on that particular project. It's the closest you can get to the convenience of softsynth total recall.

ORIGINAL: michael japan

very interesting thread. I do not say anything here to disagree with anyone or to try to prove a point--I speak from personal experience and being a producer with clients and deadlines for years. Believe me, Roland, Yamaha, and Korg have bigger fish to fry.-plus they'd be shooting themselves in the foot at the moment to make a softsynth that competes with their keyboards that all cost over $2000.

I think that today's market is segmenting. More and more there are hardware folks and software folks. Used to be (going all the way back to the original DX7...heck to my first Rhodes) I'd have to have every new keyboard that appeared. Both for the latest technology and the latest sounds. Plus hardware was all there was. But those days have past. Now whether you seek sample based "authentic" sounds or "synthesized" sounds your options are many and mostly top notch. I haven't bought a new keyboard in years...I use an Alesis QS8 as my controller. I do have some rack units...Triton, Roland xv3080, Wavestation SR...but that's it. Where I used to have scads of units in several racks, I'm now mostly "in the box". I don't see any of the big boys keyboard sales being overly impacted by software emulations of their "big guns". Folks who are "keyboard" people will still by 'em and folks who are "software" people will buy that. And...even better for Korg, Yamaha, etal...some will buy both! But in the end I don't think anyone can stop the demise of hardware...it's coming whether we like it or not.

Hi:
I have the Korg Wavestation EX (hardware) and the software Korg Legacy Digital Edition. For my ears, the sound I hear is the same from the two.
Greetings.

I see no interest in a software version of synths like the Triton...

there are certain signature sounds in Triton that makes things much easier in the Urban market. So virtual Tritons would be welcome here...

The main thing I hate about VSTis....... DXis.... is that with everything powered down, I have to start up the computer, Start Sonar, then Start my softsynth, then select the patches/instruments I want to use. Alot of that is solved, by leaving my DAW on all the time........ I'm OK with that...... and setting up a Normal.cwt for the way I work, so it seems like I'm just starting Sonar.

have you look into Track Templates? this completely solves the problem without having to rely on Normal.cwt.

I usually fire up SONAR on instinct not readily knowing which instruments I'll be using. A track template lets you select an instrument completely ready to go, with MIDI tracks, multi-output audio tracks,patch selections, selected track for echo etc.

ORIGINAL: D.Triny

I see no interest in a software version of synths like the Triton...

there are certain signature sounds in Triton that makes things much easier in the Urban market. So virtual Tritons would be welcome here...

I 2nd that...