• SONAR
  • Rallentando Tempo Map...?
2013/03/18 14:23:21
jrobbins2112
Could use some help folks.... I'm working on drums for a collaboration online and have run into something new that has me baffled and frustrated.  Below is what the guitar player sent me so I could set up my tempo map on my side....
-------------- 
the song starts at 85bpm, has a rallentando from the 2nd beat of measure 46 thru measure 48, slowing to 67bpm
measure 48 itself is 7/8 while the rest of the song is 4/4
measure 49 thru the end is at 100bpm
this track starts with one measure of "wind" and then comes in with the piano / classical guitar duet.
---------------
 
When I import the .wav (it's a broadcast wav).... I see some information in a bunch of markers on the timeline... but it must be too long because I don't see the acutal BPM numbers (its like they get truncated)......
 
I guess my REAL QUESTION IS:
 
Can I import this wav and have MY Sonar Tempo Map follow the IMPORTED wav's tempo....????
 
(I'm using Superior Drums and Rolands to do the drums in MIDI).
2013/03/18 14:47:17
chuckebaby
you need the project,  id ask him for a copy of the project, its tiny in size.
unless im mistaken wav files don't carry tempo information in them unless they're acid files, are these acid files ?
you can always go to the marks where the tempo changes and draw in your own tempos, its easy.
place the transport line where the timeline is set on, choose/ project/tempo change/insert new tempo then you can put in a new tempo from the drop out box, fill in the info, you don't even need to go in to a mapping screen.
 
you can also change from 4/4 to 7/8 in this same box. 
2013/03/18 15:06:03
jrobbins2112
Thanks Charlie.... they aren't acidized... just regular broadcast waves.

My first attempt was to add the tempo data manually at the markers... but for some reason (I suppose because it's alot of info) it truncates the data and I don't see what the BPM actually is.

He did the project in Reaper or Logic I believe.... it would be super nice if it was a Sonar project!!! hehe

I was REALLY hoping there was some kinda way to tell Sonar to use that information from the markers somehow that I just didn't know about.....

I did drag the file into SONY VEGAS 12 out of curiosity.... and I CAN see the bpm data there....so I can write it down and then do it manually in Sonar.... although that does piss me off a little bit.... when I have a DAW that doesn't even do what a video editor is doing with markers...lolololol

Thanks again.... if you think of anything else please let me know!
2013/03/18 15:11:28
chuckebaby
in order to see the bpm sonar has to be right on top of it or playing it(the content.)
there is a setting in sonar called import all audio at its original timestamp.
see if this helps.
its in preferences/audio  :)
2013/03/18 15:22:24
jrobbins2112
Nada..... it was worth a try though!  The BPM just stays at Sonars default 120.  I did just learn what the:

Apply SMPTE offset to Broadcast Wave Timestamps -

does... so that was COOL!  Just not what I needed it to do with the tempo!  hehe
2013/03/18 15:32:16
jrobbins2112
BTW....

If anyone wants to hear/see what this drumless file looks like.... this isn't a super secret file or anything...lololol

You do have to be a member of KOMPOZ.com but its free and there is no spam or weirdness that comes from this site... it's just a musicians collaboration portal that is open to all.... and no I didn't get paid to say that or anything...lololol

http://www.kompoz.com/compose-collaborate/home.track.project?trackId=247573&projectId=38011

It is an interesting tempo problem that has my OCD at an all time high.........!!!!!
2013/03/18 16:04:15
stickman393
I recommend exploring "fit to improvization". 

You'll need to record a second midi click track (in "free-time", in sync with the audio drum track), placing a note on each 1/4 beat. Then SONAR's "fit to improv" tool adjusts the tempo track to match your midi track. 

This works extremely well, but it took me a few attempts before i got all the ducks in a row to get it to work. 

2013/03/18 16:09:20
jrobbins2112
Thanks stickman!  I hadn't thought of that.....

I just had an idea when as you were posting this.... I have yet to see if it works....

In the TEMPO MAP view.... I can DRAW a straight line from measure 46 to 48 (with the pencil tool).  I will post back if this works. 

I think Charlie might have mentioned this technique earlier and I just missed it...... 
2013/03/18 16:59:13
jrobbins2112
I haven't solved this totally yet... but the answer is....

INSERT A SERIES OF TEMPOS

From the project menu.... now I am suspect about the info I was given between the measures....

Just FYI guys....

2013/03/18 17:32:15
brundlefly
Easier to do than to describe. I downloaded the file, and aligned it to the timeline using Set Measure/Beat At Now. His clicks in the rallentando part don't really follow the music, so I picked out the beats by ear and eye.

Here's what I came up with, and you can just enter these in your tempo map. Note that the Rallentando starts earlier than he says, and actually ends at 46:04:480 with the next downbeat coming in way early, which is why the tempo jumps to 137+ at the end of the bar.

01:01:000     85.00
45:03:000     74.50
45:04:000     73.08
46:02:000     71.43
46:03:480     66.70
46:04:000    137.59
47:01:000    100.00






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