Greetings Forum!
 
I'm trying to capture SysEx between Sonar X2a and my Mackie d8b/D8Bridge MCU emulator.
 
Is it possible for Sonar X2a to record SysEx messages sent out by the mackiecontrol.dll to a MIDI device?  I know I can send pre-edited or pre-recorded SysEx banks out to a device, and I can record inbound SysEx, but can I monitor and record what Sonar X2a is sending out the mackiecontrol.dll using Sonar X2a itself, or will I need to sniff Sonar X2a MIDI Out ports with something like MIDI-OX?  I haven't found any clues in the Sonar Reference Guide section on System Exclusive Data (p1139 - p1152).
 
Grateful for any assistance.  Thank you!

In Preferences>Midi<Playback and Recording, there is by default a checked box telling Sonar to record System Exclusive data.

Can you please elaborate on what you mean for "but can I monitor and record what Sonar X2a is sending out the mackiecontrol.dll using Sonar X2a itself"?  I am trying to understand this but don't have enough coffee in me to grasp what you are trying to do.

If you have existing System Exclusive data in a Sonar project, you can use the System Exclusive View (View>Sysx).  If this is not what you are seeking, then I do not understand what you are trying to do, hence my request for some elaboration on what you are trying to do.

Bob Bone

@robert_e_bone
 
Hi Bob,
 
I appreciate your interest and I hope you've had some good coffee to get you started. 
 
The gist of what I am trying to do is to capture bidirectional MIDI SysEx, both outbound from X2a and inbound to X2a with the BluAudio D8Bridge v1.1 MCU emulation software.  The BluAudio D8Bridge emulation software v1.1 (and its companion custom serial I/O cable) aspires to translate between the Mackie d8b mixer native serial I/O and the MCU protocol.  On the DAW host, sitting between the D8Bridge MCU translator software and Sonar X2a is the LoopBE30 software MIDI patchbay.  The idea is that the Mackie d8b acts as a 25 fader control surface and it appears to Sonar X2a as if it is a generic MCU + 2 XTs through the D8Bridge software.
 
My motivation is that I would like to examine the format and content of the SysEx exchanged between Sonar X2a and BluAudio D8Bridge v1.1 to determine if and where the protocol deviates from what I believe to be correct.  I suspect that something's not right in the integration of X2a and the D8Bridge MCU emulator since some of the behavior of my control surface is not quite right.  Many things work beautifully - faders, mute, solo, pan, record enable, LED level meters, transport controls, MBT/SMPTE readout, LCD readout, jog/scrub, etc., but some things just aren't working properly, for example the select buttons on the tracks (I understand from FBB and others that this feature works properly for genuine Mackie MCU users in X2a).  I haven't made much headway with BluAudio yet in resolving my issues, but BluAudio's kind of a one-man shop and unable to engage at the moment.  And I don't really expect to hear from Cakewalk on the status of the mackiecontrol.dll, although I have logged a bug request asking that they ensure that the DLL is fully compliant with the MCU SDK in X2b.  In the mean time, I figure any diagnostics I can supply to either of those two parties may go toward resolving some of the MCU interface goofiness I'm experiencing.  This d8b/D8Bridge control surface arrangement is nearly perfect for my needs; if I could just get the last bits integrated and functioning properly I would be thrilled.
 
So, I know I can grab SysEx inbound to Sonar X2a with the technique you described in the opening line of your post; that will give me what D8Bridge is sending to Sonar X2a.  I'm wondering if I can also capture outbound SysEx from Sonar X2a to D8Bridge in the same manner.  I haven't had any success with that and I was curious if other users had been able to record outbound SysEx.  I can always experiment, and I will, but I was trying to take the lazy route and see if the knowledge is already out there.  As an alternative I may be able to run MIDI-OX on the LoopBE30 virtual MIDI ports to capture outbound SysEx from Sonar X2a to D8Bridge, but I've seen some instabilities running MIDI-OX on Win7 x64 alongside Sonar X2a x64 and wanted to avoid any messaging catastrophe as a consequence of sniffing on the LoopBE30 ports.
 
I know that was a load, sorry, but that's pretty much what I'm up to, some basic SysEx troubleshooting of the MCU protocol between X2a and D8Bridge.
 
Thanks and best regards. 

I would use MIDI-OX for that though I do not think the MC transmits sysex only notes.

I agree with John, patch in midiox using loopbe30 between sonar and D8Bridge.

for example:

Sonar -> loopbe1 -> MidiOx -> loopbe2 -> D8Bridge
Sonar <- loopbe4 <- MidiOx <- loopbe3 <- D8Bridge

Then in MidiOx use the router to patch:
loopbe1 -> loopbe2
loopbe3 -> loopbe4

The you can use the midiox i/o windows to see the data.

Edit: I had to re-entry the patching as the forum software ate my code. :(

I am still a bit confused - even with TWO cups of fresh coffee with French vanilla.

Thanks for the incredible detail by the way.  I wish other folks were that cooperative when I ask them for additional information.

If you are talking about working with an entire sysx bank, when your project is loading, Sonar by default should be asking you if you want to send sysx data, if you have that bank checked for auto-send.

Here is the doc link for that:

http://www.cakewalk.com/D...q=SYSX.05.html#1113216

And, for working with a sysx bank, that data should be coming from a file already existing for your project.  Sooooo, couldn't you just examine that file to review the sysx data - using the Sysx Viewer?

If you are recording sysx data in real time, it will show up in the event list for that midi track, and you can view it with View>Event List.

Here is the doc link for that:

http://www.cakewalk.com/D...q=SYSX.11.html#1140642

It sounds to me like you are talking about wanting to record sysx data in real-time, which will save it as midi events for the given midi track - as a series of sysx data events.  After you capture those events (2nd link above), you can examine those and confirm their correctness.  Follow the instructions in that 2nd link for getting it set right to transmit those events back during playback.  To view these sysx data events, you would use View>Event List for that track.

Or, should I go ahead and have that THIRD cup of Joe?

Bob Bone

@robert_e_bone, @John, @js516,
 
Thank you all for your suggestions.  I had already done some MIDI-OX SysEx capture on the MIDI interface between X2a and D8Bridge.  The MCU interface uses SysEx to transmit messages bidirectionally.    
 
The messages I've seen are of the form 0xF0 0x00 0x00 0x66 0x14 <message ID> <message payload> F7, where the first byte F0 marks the start of the SysEx message, the next 3 bytes 0x00 0x00 0x66 identify Mackie as the manufacturer, the next byte 0x14 identifies the MCU as the machine ID, the next byte is the message type and everything else up to the terminating F7 SysEx end byte is the message payload for the message type.
 
As I mentioned earlier in the thread, when running MIDI-OX (x32) alongside Sonar X2a x64 on Win7 x64 I saw some instabilities in X2a's behavior and I didn't want my MIDI-OX monitoring method to adversely affect what I was trying to monitor.  I have not tried the inline monitoring that js516 suggests; I was just hanging MIDI-OX off the LoopBE30 ports for X2a and D8Bridge, so I may try wiring things up that way and see if it's more stable.
 
Bob, I think your coffee dosage was perfect.  Yes, I want to capture real time SysEx both arriving at the X2a MIDI In and departing X2a MIDI Out for later parsing, analysis, and comparision with the MCU interface spec.  Using X2a to record SysEx at the X2a MIDI In is a no-brainer.  I still haven't determined whether or not I can use the same X2a SysEx recording technique to record SysEx at the X2a MIDI Out.  I'll have to do some experimenting.  If anyone's interested in the outcome I can follow up here or in another thread.
 
I really appreciate all your good ideas.