Hello,

I have a Kurzweil PC3 and can't seem to get an instrument definition to work properly in Sonar. The problem is that the Kurzweil starts numbering at 1 and the bank select CC0 value changes at 128, but the bank designation in the keyboard does not increment until patch 129.

This is how the PC3 responds to CC0 and PC messages:

[Base 1] (bank 1)
CC0=0, PC=0 - "0 None" (on the PC3 display)
CC0=0, PC=1 - "1 Standard Grand"
...
CC0=0, PC=127 - "127 Magic Celeste"
CC0=1, PC=0 - "128 Drums 'n Bells"

[Base 2](bank 2)
CC0=1, PC=1 - "129 Piano Stack"
etc.

See how the MIDI bank select (CC0) is out by 1.

This means that Sonar will group the programs like this:

[Base 1]
CC0=0, PC=0 - "0 None"
CC0=0, PC=1 - "1 Standard Grand"
...
CC0=0, PC=127 - "127 Magic Celeste"

[Base 2]
CC0=1, PC=0 - "128 Drums 'n Bells" << This should be in base 1
CC0=1, PC=1 - "129 Piano Stack"
etc.

The reason for this post is a hope that I've missed something, and there is a way to solve this. Other DAWs I've used have allowed CC0, CC32 and PC to be specified for every patch and that makes it very flexibile.

Do you have the correct INS Definition File??? I use a wide array of Keyboards, Karma, Motif, Roland D70, JV-80, Korg CX3 Organ, Hammond XB-2 Organ, ect & all of them have worked in Sonar since Sonar 2.2XL.. I used to have a Kurweil & that was a tricky INS file to find. Try going to the Sonar Wiki, or Google INS Files & you've got a good chance of finding the files needed.. Wildman

I don't have an answer to your question but I'm envious of your ownership of the PC3.

I've been lusting over one of those since they first came out. (Still trying to persuade Mrs Jeff that it's an absolute must to keep my creative juices flowing!)

ORIGINAL: b3gsus@msn.com

Do you have the correct INS Definition File???

I made one based on information from this site: http://www.tweakheadz.com/how_to_build_a_cakewalk_ins_file.htm

I also downloaded one made by somone else and it has the same problem.

The only way I can see to solve this is if there is a way to define CC0 mesages for each patch, rather than by bank.

ORIGINAL: jeffb63
I'm envious of your ownership of the PC3.

It's a very versatile keyboard and sounds great. Now, if I can only convince it and Sonar to be friends. :)

I've been lusting over one of those since they first came out. (Still trying to persuade Mrs Jeff that it's an absolute must to keep my creative juices flowing!)

You can tell her from me that it is an essential tool. If she doesn't believe me, who will she believe? I have the 88 key weighted version (PC3x).

I have the 88 key weighted version (PC3x).

Nice!!

ORIGINAL: jeffb63

I have the 88 key weighted version (PC3x).

Nice!!

Here's my setup.

AFAIK there's no way to get Sonar to use 129 patches in a bank. It interprets a change in the BankSelect (CC0) value as a change in bank.

I'm pretty sure that the fact that Sonar displays the 129th patch as bank 2 when the PC3 displays it as bank1 wont effect the usability of the patch - other than you having to remember the difference when selecting.

ORIGINAL: ducatibruce2

AFAIK there's no way to get Sonar to use 129 patches in a bank. It interprets a change in the BankSelect (CC0) value as a change in bank.

I'm pretty sure that the fact that Sonar displays the 129th patch as bank 2 when the PC3 displays it as bank1 wont effect the usability of the patch - other than you having to remember the difference when selecting.

Yes, it does work. It just bothers me when things are not nicely ordered. I was hoping I'd missed something, and there was a way to overcome this.

There was a small utility program floating around called KRZtoINS or something similar that would read Kurzweils SYS ex dump and create a Instrument definition file that you could just cut and paste in notepad. Other than that I believe there is a switch in the main instrument definition allowing you to use cc32 for bank change format that Kurzweil uses.