Vastman
Agree with Mike on all accounts...we are all victims... including the bakers...

Don't play innocent victim.. The bakers were quite aware of Gibson's track record along with many musicians or anyone who frequents other music related forums. It was mentioned so many times on this forum as well.
I only feel sorry for those who weren't aware of Gibson's past business dealings but staff surely knew of the risks from the get go.

Hi:)
 
I'm not angry with the Bakers, they have all done very well over the years!!!
 
Great Software, great Forum, I'll stay with it!!
 
Bassman.

azslow3, I agree to your analysis about the plan... But we cannot prove it. And obviously they know that people have just lost a few dollars (for me 115 euros, it won't change anything for me but I'm just disappointed and frustrated). So they know they don't risk a class action or something like that.
 
About the first part of your message (about my own case), strictly speaking you are right. Again, I don't really know US law, but consumer action was born there...
In France, the courts wouldn't accept this strict reading of the law. You couldn't say "I gave you lifetime updates, but in fact it was two days and now I can close the company". There is a notion of sincerity in the business, especially the consumer business which is maybe half of Cakewalk activity (but you can be sure there are thieves too here!).
 
Imagine another example: imagine a network of fitness clubs in a country, say France. One day the Marseilles club tells you : "pay for 2 years now, and this is lifetime!". After one year, the Paris headquarters say : we close the Marseilles club but keep the rest of the clubs. And we keep the money from Marseilles people. In this case, the firm would be prosecuted for misleading offer.

EU has better consumer protection laws, so anyone in EU recently buying 12 months worth will be able to get it back; in the US i'm not so sure (do you even have any consumer protection laws in the US??) so your best bet is via your payment method, paypal or cc, rather than via the (re-)seller
good luck!

Let's fix this conversation:

The SCAM mention herein lies solely with Gibson (who in turn SCAMMED even Cakewalk and their employees) who allowed and indeed advertised the sale of products up to the day before shutting everything down.  Since I work in the business community, nobody is ever going to convince me that Gibson woke up Tuesday morning and thought suddenly "gee, let's shut down Cakewalk today" and then hastily penned the announcement.  They knew bloody good and well this was happening and decided that taking people's money right up to the end was perfectly acceptable business practice.  Now I don't know how anyone else defines the word SCAM, but in my mind this is a textbook example of one UNLESS people are treated fairly and can recoup their bilked money OR be able to get what they paid for to the letter of the promises made to them -- namely you pay in full and it's yours to keep and use FOREVER.

I for one realize that Cakewalk employees got rear-ended first, hardest and worst and were not responsible for this debacle.  I feel for them in a BIG way, I truly do and they are by my estimation victims as well.  But it's childish to think or say that Gibson (who pulls the corporate strings) acted in any way, shape or form in a proper business fashion.  They have treated their customers through Cakewalk like suckers and then left everyone here (including the employees) scrambling.  The rest of thoughts on Gibson and their nut job CEO are being withheld due to my belief system and a modicum of decency.

ebibault51
azslow3, I agree to your analysis about the plan... But we cannot prove it.

I work in science since previous century... Not every theory has a prove when released. (Sometime rather big...) experiments are build for the prove. What is less known is that most experiments "un-prove", "Close" the theories. Confirmations ("Openings") are rare.
But a theory is broadly accepted as possible only in case it make sense. I mean before any prove.
 
My problem is that every published intention as an explanation for very strange change in Cakewalk was not sounding convincing. At least not for me. I repeat a part of the list:
* "membership". 2 Years development for the price on one. In addition AD2 pack, retail nominated as that price alone. Country specific prices, sometime questionably hi, sometimes questionably low (take into account, that AD2 pack and 3d party licenses had no and have no differentiations, I mean it is unlikely the fee CW had to pay was differentiated). Gift?
* "improvement in support". Practically cancellation of support. "Transition", "new team training", "extreme number of users".
* "monthly updates". Optimizing work of small team? How a small team can develop something serious (we was told all changes was to make CW working better...), when they have to release something every month?
* "lifetime membership". For the top version. Gift?
 
So, when put in chronological list until now, all that make marketing sense. But otherwise it does not. At all. Not in marketing, not in logic.
 
I would like to see any other theory. But as I have written in another thread, it should also have at least some sense. At least in something.
 

Imagine another example: imagine a network of fitness clubs in a country, say France. One day the Marseilles club tells you : "pay for 2 years now, and this is lifetime!". After one year, the Paris headquarters say : we close the Marseilles club but keep the rest of the clubs. And we keep the money from Marseilles people. In this case, the firm would be prosecuted for misleading offer.

Most people have paid for Lifetime in 2016 the usual price of update for one (!) year. So for 2017. That was delivered.
You had a ticket for one year in Marseilles club. You have asked, "can I buy a ticket for the next year now?" and they have answered "yes, you can...". In one month after that, there was an offer "lifetime ticket" and you took it as well. In one and half year the club is closed. I guess even in France courthouse the first question you will be asked "when taking lifetime ticket, have you tried to cancel the ticket for the next year, since it was clearly superseded by the lifetime?"
So, have you mailed CW last august that you have paid for 2017 already, before taking lifetime? What was the answer? CW was alway kind in that respect, to all customers. I will be surprised in case you have asked but have received no offer...
 

SiberianKhatru59
The SCAM mention herein lies solely with Gibson (who in turn SCAMMED even Cakewalk and their employees) who allowed and indeed advertised the sale of products up to the day before shutting everything down.

Your proposal will be to close the shop 31 December last year, without any explanation or the explanation "we will continue our development till November, but since then it will be stopped we no longer sell anything?". I do not remember I have ever seen such marketing scenario, CW was "creative" in marketing last years, but no so creative
 

When Craig made his announcement the clock had already started ticking in my mind.
I hesitate to post negative comments especially here.
I had hopes of a different outcome but Gibson woes were everywhere.
 
 
Suppose those of us who never used another DAW should make a decision. I friend been pushing me to get Studio One. I'm too old for this $h1t! LOL!
 
Oh, I want to thank all of you for your help these past two years!
Best forum anywhere.

azslow3

SiberianKhatru59
The SCAM mention herein lies solely with Gibson (who in turn SCAMMED even Cakewalk and their employees) who allowed and indeed advertised the sale of products up to the day before shutting everything down.

Your proposal will be to close the shop 31 December last year, without any explanation or the explanation "we will continue our development till November, but since then it will be stopped we no longer sell anything?". I do not remember I have ever seen such marketing scenario, CW was "creative" in marketing last years, but no so creative
 

You left his off the end of my quoted words above:

Now I don't know how anyone else defines the word SCAM, but in my mind this is a textbook example of one UNLESS people are treated fairly and can recoup their bilked money OR be able to get what they paid for to the letter of the promises made to them -- namely you pay in full and it's yours to keep and use FOREVER.

In other words, so long as Gibson makes things right with all their customers to the extent that is possible, I'm fine with things.

My comment was about "advertised the sale of products up to the day before shutting everything down" only. I mean the only alternative I have seen was "end of life sale". But with the membership model that is also not better...

For my own case, it was a Cakewalk proposition (by e-mail ; after that I NEVER received the newsletter again, although the item was checked in my account).
I found this proposition strange (how would they do to earn something in the future if anyone bought a lifetime update?), but one of the "bakers" said here that the business plan was OK, because they thought that it would create a solid community that would buy add-ons (plugins...). So I was a little bit worried for Cakewalk and for my money too... but I paid.
I clearly understood that I would pay something like 2 years in advance, and that was not a problem. Because they convinced me that the software would exist much longer. So the offer seemed to be fair, it's the way it ended up that is not.
Today I feel disappointed because I love this software line, it helped me to become a musician. And the community is nice.
 
And what do you think about that :
I have lost 115 euros in the lifetime updates. BUT if Cakewalk/Gibson had said instead at the time of the lifetime updates:
"We have some financial problems. Help us and take shares" or "let's do a crowdfunding operation to help us build the future of SONAR".
I would have paid 115 euros or more with a lot of pleasure!