craigb

WTF is Waldo?
 
Oh ya, now I see. He's on the clarinet.

slartabartfast
One of the greatest what the ... moments of my life was when I learned that the keyboard was considered part of the rhythm section of a modern small pop or jazz ensemble, along with the bass and drums. And this was at a time when the only keyboard around was a piano. The pre-eminent solo and vocal accompaniment instrument since its invention three hundred years ago had somehow fallen so low in pop music practice that it sat with the skin thumpers? Sure it had been invitation only to the full orchestra on concerto night, but really...
 
I blame the trumpet. In a loud sweaty dance hall someone had to carry the melody over the noise of stomping feet and smashing beer steins, and unamplified strings lacked the definition to direct the riot on the floor. And then they invented the infinitely amplifiable electric guitar and the rest is history. Bye, bye Mr. Armstrong. The power chords and fuzz boxes can drown out even the war horn in battle. 
 
For a while the electric organ got to grab the melody for brief solos rising above the din when the guitarists were busy smashing their instruments, but even a standing keyboardist couldn't look like he was having coitus with his tool and still play, and thrusting his gyrating genitals was a waste when it was hidden behind the Hammond. 
 
And now, as you note, the synth technician is not really a keyboardist at all. Often as not he is triggering loops and lighting effects, and playing not just chords but fancy riffs with a single key strike on a MIDI controller where the only skill is knowing how to make the noise at the right time. Hey. Sounds a lot like he belongs in the rhythm section. 
 
But your point about style is wrong. There are many consummate keyboard players in bands, and they can develop whatever distinctive style they want...or not. What you are really saying is that the fashion in pop music arrangement is still designed around an accompaniment for the visual SEXY of a dancing front man and his sexy string bashing wing men. Find a band that plays the kind of music you want to play, and does not depend on stroking the cliche between the audience's ears. Remain seated and concentrate on the music. And learn to do arrangements that your fellow musicians will respect. Or just do what the front man tells you and stay out of the way and on the beat. 
 
 

This kind of makes not want to play at all. For the record though, I'm not really interested in fronting. I am not a singer by any means, and I am not advocating having the majority of the limelight. I just to be viewed as an equal with the right to choose my own sounds with no pressure from everybody else.

Perhaps you are right about the state of modern music. I grew up with Depeche Mode, A Flock of Seagulls, and other similar bands. It is rare these days to see an all synth band. Unless you want pre-packaged Bieber stuff.

I really don't want to get into triggering lighting and effects, even though my JP-50 has Visual Control built in. Maybe that, in itself, is a sign I should've stuck with guitar. But honestly, I can't play that anymore. Smoking has left me with several "pointed" fingers, and it is hard to fret anything now, save a few bar chords.

So the question is, with my basic method of playing (usually holding bass and a chord for a few measures), with only the occasional melody line, how do I break free from this and start really playing? Keep in mind, I haven't changed since I was 13, and I am now 47. It can't be practice because I've done nothing BUT play, having had a stroke seven years ago. I just can't seem to get any better.

Advice?

If you want to break out of what others expect of you, then you simply need to assert yourself. If it sounds good, isn't inappropriate for the situation and doesn't step all over someone else's toes, you may find that everyone is happy regardless of whatever expectations they might have had going in.
 
But if you are musical yet they can't accept this sort of assertiveness from you, then you have to evaluate if you want to be in a situation that doesn't allow you to express yourself. 

drewfx1
If you want to break out of what others expect of you, then you simply need to assert yourself. If it sounds good, isn't inappropriate for the situation and doesn't step all over someone else's toes, you may find that everyone is happy regardless of whatever expectations they might have had going in.
 
But if you are musical yet they can't accept this sort of assertiveness from you, then you have to evaluate if you want to be in a situation that doesn't allow you to express yourself. 

I think you may have misunderstood my last question. Assuming that's the one you responded to just now.

My hands do not work at the same time. If my right is playing a simple melody, my left is either holding a single note, or nothing at all, and vice versa. Similarly, I am not adept at anything faster than eighth notes, and not for very long.

This is true in just about all aspects of my life, outside of music as well. I can learn the basics of things really fast, but then can not get past the "below average" threshold. For instance, I can plink out the melody notes to "Wishing (If I had a Photograph of You)" rather easily, but if I were asked to play "Sad Songs (Say so much)" you can forget it. That's a level of playing I just can't do.

When I write a song, I start with a keyboard pad, where I am in A for two to four measures, then D, then C. It is exceedingly difficult for me to do a more "moving" piece where they keys are all over the place. I try and try, and practice and practice, to no avail.

What I am now asking is what can I do to break free from this "boxed" method of playing?

Serenarules


How many easily identifiable musicians (guitar, bass, drums only) do you know that have drastically different sounds from song to song?


 

Without thinking about it too much, I'll offer Mark Knopfler.
 
His guitar sound on 'Sultans of Swing' is nothing like 'Romeo and Juliet' is nothing like 'Money For Nothing' is nothing like 'Hill Farmer's Blues' is nothing like 'Quality Shoe' is nothing like 'Sailing to Philadelphia'...etc...but you can still tell it's him on all of them, because of his phrasing.
 

jamesg1213

Serenarules


How many easily identifiable musicians (guitar, bass, drums only) do you know that have drastically different sounds from song to song?


 

Without thinking about it too much, I'll offer Mark Knopfler.
 
His guitar sound on 'Sultans of Swing' is nothing like 'Romeo and Juliet' is nothing like 'Money For Nothing' is nothing like 'Hill Farmer's Blues' is nothing like 'Quality Shoe' is nothing like 'Sailing to Philadelphia'...etc...but you can still tell it's him on all of them, because of his phrasing.
 

.....also Joe Satch

Serenarules
 
My hands do not work at the same time. If my right is playing a simple melody, my left is either holding a single note, or nothing at all, and vice versa. Similarly, I am not adept at anything faster than eighth notes, and not for very long.

So you are physically incapable of mastering a virtuoso, or maybe even an average, live performance on your chosen instrument, with no cure in sight. Advice is not going to fix that. I have the same problem, but as a result of being too lazy to do the kind of boring practice necessary, which at my stage of life is probably also chronic and progressive. My solution is to use adaptive devices in order to make music without using my undisciplined neuromuscular system. MIDI sequencing will allow even a gumption deficient like me to create a performance that I could never hope to do in real time. If you are not a good composer, well you are not apparently a very good performer either, and rather than trying to force your body to do what it no longer can, you might put your time into learning to become a better composer and arranger. Working alone with your sequencer will let you choose whatever sounds and musical arrangement you want without anyone else's permission. If you produce a body of work that has value to others, burn it to disc, or take it on the road with a band and trigger the performance of your work from storage, using the coordination that you still have. 
 
Unless you believe that your struggle to overcome your handicap defines you in some ennobling way that makes the frustration worthwhile, or you enjoy the exercise of doing the best you can without expecting to achieve a goal beyond your ability, why not use your still intact intelligence to choose a more productive path? 
 
There is an apocryphal story about the Buddha, who met an old adept who was sitting beside a river.
"Tell, me old man," says the Buddha, "what you are doing here." 
"I am sitting unmoving every day accumulating spiritual power, and have done so for fifty years," replied the old man. 
"And what power have you attained as a result?" the Buddha asked.
"If I choose," said the old man, "I could stand up and walk across that river," was the answer.
The Buddha nodded.
"For a nickle, I can take the ferry," he said. 

For a while the electric organ got to grab the melody for brief solos rising above the din when the guitarists were busy smashing their instruments, but even a standing keyboardist couldn't look like he was having coitus with his tool and still play, and thrusting his gyrating genitals was a waste when it was hidden behind the Hammond. 
 
So true and it just looks awful when a keyboard player tries to be cool -- you can kind of do it on a piano but a modern keyboard with lights flashing like a ufo taking off, placed on one of these ridiculous fragile X shaped stands? come on...
 
keyboard players generally look like they have their hands trapped in the stocks which turntable DJs also suffer (but DJs can at least release themselves occasionally to drink heavily (and make 'raise the roof' hand signals) and lean over to chat up girls, because their technology does all the work for them)

Sorry guy. I was going to play but I have no idea what key you're in.
I do think it's a blues tune...one of those that the same verse keeps popping up so if I'm right...change to a different tune. Much easier sometimes than to keep working on one that sucks anyway.
 
Freaky. I'm reminded of back when the needle would get stuck and my friends that would get up and bump it...until I got up and threw the album in the trash. I don't waste my time dealing with **** that's broke...not when it's easier just to move on. Time to change the road you're on...who said that? Good when it fits...if it doesn't...kinda sucks I guess.
 
Sorry....I'm really distracted wondering if slartabartfast screwed up and meant slartibartfast...anyway I think the nickel hit the spot.

There are a TON of guitarists out there who have virtually no individual character whatsoever. Just take a look at whomever has graduated from the Musician's Institute on any particular year 
 
And then you have all of those guitarists who just use the instrument in a supporting role - like vocalists who strum a little for accompaniment. Most of that sounds pretty generic to me. Unless they're a "specialty strummer" doing intricate rhythm work (someone like John Doyle) then they're pretty interchangeable.