Hi,
Why, when someone posts, about compression, and gives an example to listen to
do I find it difficult to hear what the're talking about, then when I experiment with compression, find
it difficult to hear any changes, is this down to years of playing live, when you had a very loud backline
or something I'm missing ? 

John

Hmm. Could you expand a bit as to what extent you are missing hearing the effects of compression? It can be quite subtle with the differences between settings, or compression styles, but it should be very easy to set up- (or recommend if you like) some trial experiments to work it through in stages.
 
Are you thinking earlier hearing damage might be a factor as well?

Compression takes a long time to learn and and even longer time to master. It can take a very long time before you can even hear it. You need to train your ear to listen to the effects of compression. It won't happen over night. It took me about 5 years before I even started to hear that different compressors sound different! Granted I wasn't working hard at it over that time, so you can certainly learn much much quicker than that, but it still does take time.

For now, you need to experiment with compressors yourself. Forget listening to other people do it as it's too subtle usually. Forget trying to listen to differences between compressors as it'll do your head in for now. Start with Sonitus. It's easy to use but has plenty of options to learn on. Push your ratio up high and your threshold down low. Play with attack and release now and see what happens. Learn what's going on. Then vary thershold and ratio. You start to hear how the compressor 'works'. Play with the knee. In my experience, the best way to learn is to play with it on everything and push it HARD. If you don't do that, you won't learn what's going on. Once you start to really hear it, you can learn to dial things back and actually use it practically. Once you start to do that, you can then start playing with different compressors and try to learn why they all sound different! Don't expect to hear it overnight. It takes time.

And that's all just to get started. That's the first page of a 3000 page book. The pros out there know ten of those books off their heads. But one page at a time...

Hi jwh,
It took me a while to hear it as well...in fact, as with most things, I'm still a work in progress, but I do have a bunch of compressors, both hardware and software, and I can try to explain what my process is like.

When I listen for compression I listen for essentially three things:

1. Listen to the spaces. Listen to the material for the empty spots and then listen to what happens to those spots when compresson is engaged. When folks talk about "glue", what they mean is how sound fills in the spaces in the music. I sort of set a mental baseline for the level of the peaks in the music, (for me it's usally snare drum), then apply compression and makeup gain until those peaks are the same with the compressor engaged and with it bypassed. Use your meters to make sure that you have a good A/B test, then listen to what happens to the space around the peaks when compression is engaged.

2. Listen to transients. Another good way to think about compression is how it can minimize transients (specifically with a fast attack time). Again listen to snare drum...normally you'd hear a loud-ish initial transient followed by a fairly fast drop off in signal. Compression can squash that transient so that it's not louder than the following signal. Listen to Eric Church's "Creepin" for a good example of this in a snare drum (even if, like me, you don't much like country/western). The snare in that song is really squashed. It's compressed so that it almost sounds like a burst of static at a constant volume.

3. Listen to compression as though it were an EQ with saturation. Compressors impart a "sound", almost like an EQ with saturation (that's not quite right, but writing about sound is always a bit imprecise). A good way to see one possible example of what compressors do is by passing a sine wave through a tube compressor, applying compression and comparing the wet and dry signal in a spectrum analyzer.

Next, A/B with different compressors. Use sends and busses with different comps on them to switch back and forth. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat. Repeat again till you figure out that my descriptions are wildly off base and that the sound of compressors can only be described in terms that you understand. Explain it to someone else. Have them tell you you're wildly off base and then realize that both of you are correct :)

Good luck
Dean

Great posts. I sometimes have trouble hearing what the compressor is doing too. A tip I learned was compare the on/off states at a low volume. It's easier to hear the difference. 

Yes, compression is one of those dark sonic arts - everyone talks about it but it ain't the most obvious thing.  It is a tool that helps polish a mix (or master), not start it.  One of the worst things you can do is habitually slap compressors on everything, and that didn't use to a problem unless you were at a big studio w/ an ssl or lots 'o outboard and the head engineer wouldn't let you.

A good way to learn in addition to the above suggestions is to use comp on a bus - esp. drum bus, guitar or vocal.  Slap a comp there and experiment w/ the settings.  W/ the PC SSL bus comp the first thing you'll notice is the overall sound is softer.  Match volumes and switch the on/off button to hear the difference in texture.  Then proceed to start turning knobs - one at a time and return to zero before moving to the next knob.

@

AT


Yes, compression is one of those dark sonic arts - everyone talks about it but it ain't the most obvious thing.  It is a tool that helps polish a mix (or master), not start it.  One of the worst things you can do is habitually slap compressors on everything, and that didn't use to a problem unless you were at a big studio w/ an ssl or lots 'o outboard and the head engineer wouldn't let you.

A good way to learn in addition to the above suggestions is to use comp on a bus - esp. drum bus, guitar or vocal.  Slap a comp there and experiment w/ the settings.  W/ the PC SSL bus comp the first thing you'll notice is the overall sound is softer.  Match volumes and switch the on/off button to hear the difference in texture.  Then proceed to start turning knobs - one at a time and return to zero before moving to the next knob.

@

          Thanks  AT !
           It just seemed to me nothing much was happening, when someone would say to, apply a little compression
           I was struggling to hear any change, but I'll have a try at your suggestions


           Cheers
           John

At this recording compression thing for years and I am still continuing to learn.

jwh


Hi,
Why, when someone posts, about compression, and gives an example to listen to
do I find it difficult to hear what the're talking about, then when I experiment with compression, find
it difficult to hear any changes, is this down to years of playing live, when you had a very loud backline
or something I'm missing ? 

John

 
I don't think it's related to having a loud backline. Think about the conventional uses for a guitarist/bassist. If you're playing rhythm guitar and you want the volume to be consistent you can use a compressor to even out the dynamics. If you try it while you're playing it should be noticable (if the compressor is set correctly). It is often used for the same reason on bass. What the compressor is doing is limiting the louder spikes in volume and boosting the softer passages. Since it boosts the soft pasages you can make use of that to get more sustain from a lead guitar, as the note starts to fade the volume is raised so it sustains longer. In these cases where it's strickly dynamics people tend to favor transparent compressors.
 
Once you start playing with compression and using different compressors you'll find some are more transparent than others and there are side effects of the compression so people start to employ some of the effects - it can add punch, I think there are some examples in cakewalk videos that demonstrate pumping, etc.
 
In a guitar's effect chain the compressor often has a level control so it also becomes a gain stage and can be used as a boost to drive the amp or a fuzz/OD/Distortion pedal.
 

+1 on exaggerating the controls to hear what they do. Then dialing back.
I read once where, with most FX (and mixing in general), you can get good results by setting them to "too much", checking the setting, then setting to "Too little", checking the setting and then placing it in the middle. 
Over time those swings get smaller.