Yes, Win IS still available...

I was just about to post a warning on Windows 8.

I had been running Windows 7 x64 for quite a long time, and had really great system latency, as reported by DPC Latency Checker - less than 100 us.  I decided a few days back to go ahead and perform a clean install on the same hardware to Windows 8 Pro x64.

The installation of all software was fine, but with no hardware changes whatsoever, I now see a consistent latency, as reported by DPC Latency Checker, at more than 1000 us.  That's NOT cool.

I have been through the exercise of disabling both hardware devices, running applications and services, and still have not found out what is causing the massive increase in reported latency.  

So, MY vote is to wait a bit before jumping into Windows 8, until some more folks get a chance to report back on their experiences.

If I cannot determine the cause of the 10-fold increase in system latency by tonight, I will likely tomorrow be reverting back, via a clean install, to Windows 7 x64.

I will post back tomorrow my solution or my re-install.

Bob Bone

Well, I am having CROW for dinner, it seems.

I just finished posting above, about how suddenly DPC Latency checker is reporting extremely high latency on my newly-installed Windows 8 system.

I went off to look for web info on Windows 8 latency and found a REALLY informative blurb from the DPC Latency site itself:

Here is what they say:

Windows 8 Compatibility: The DPC latency utility runs on Windows 8 but does not show correct values. The output suggests that the Windows 8 kernel performs badly and introduces a constant latency of one millisecond which is not the case in practice. DPCs in the Windows 8 kernel behave identical to Windows 7. The utility produces incorrect results because the implementation of kernel timers has changed in Windows 8 which causes a side effect with the measuring algorithm used by the utility. Thesycon is working on a new version of the DPC latency utility and will make it available on this site as soon as it is finished.
 
DPC Latency Checker for Windows 7, Windows 7 x64, Windows Vista, Windows Vista x64, Windows Server 2003, Windows Server 2003 x64, Windows XP, Windows XP x64, Windows 2000


So I take it all back - I will be leaving Windows 8 Pro x64 on my system and please just ignore my earlier post on this - sorry about all the fuss.

Bob Bone

robert_e_bone


I was just about to post a warning on Windows 8.

I had been running Windows 7 x64 for quite a long time, and had really great system latency, as reported by DPC Latency Checker - less than 100 us.  I decided a few days back to go ahead and perform a clean install on the same hardware to Windows 8 Pro x64.

The installation of all software was fine, but with no hardware changes whatsoever, I now see a consistent latency, as reported by DPC Latency Checker, at more than 1000 us.  That's NOT cool.

I have been through the exercise of disabling both hardware devices, running applications and services, and still have not found out what is causing the massive increase in reported latency.  

So, MY vote is to wait a bit before jumping into Windows 8, until some more folks get a chance to report back on their experiences.

If I cannot determine the cause of the 10-fold increase in system latency by tonight, I will likely tomorrow be reverting back, via a clean install, to Windows 7 x64.

I will post back tomorrow my solution or my re-install.

Bob Bone

DPC latency checker doesn't work with Windows 8. It will run but gives the wrong results.  You need have no fear using Windows 8. See this thread. Post 13 has the answer. Here is the developer page that says the same thing.


"So I take it all back - I will be leaving Windows 8 Pro x64 on my system and please just ignore my earlier post on this - sorry about all the fuss."

Its too late Bob, I already posted a correction.  LOL

Try using LatencyMon instead, which I can confirm now works around the kernel timer change in Win8 (and provides more info than Thesycon's DPC latency checker anyway):

http://resplendence.com/latencymon_whatsnew

Interesting information.

Well, the bottom line is..... WIN8 can surprise you with incompatibilities. WIN7 is the OS to beat on stability. Alot of development time went into Win7. If you have customers waiting go WIN7. If you buy new and are a consumer... buy WIN8.

I have been battling WIN8 because I upgraded from WIN7 and it did not say AVIRA antivirus should be uninstalled. So it was on my system. I have had 3 weeks of daily blue screens. Then I was forced to examine the dmp files windows had created. Through that information I found out Win8 is not compatible. Fortunily Win8 has a build in antivirus. So that's what I am using now.

Windows 8 you have to create a second USER. And leave the ADMINISTRATOR there for install purposes. The METRO invironment is only working properly on a USER account. Wich is a good thing. But it took me some time to get used to...

Muziekschuur at home


Interesting information.

Well, the bottom line is..... WIN8 can surprise you with incompatibilities. WIN7 is the OS to beat on stability. Alot of development time went into Win7. If you have customers waiting go WIN7. If you buy new and are a consumer... buy WIN8.

I have been battling WIN8 because I upgraded from WIN7 and it did not say AVIRA antivirus should be uninstalled. So it was on my system. I have had 3 weeks of daily blue screens. Then I was forced to examine the dmp files windows had created. Through that information I found out Win8 is not compatible. Fortunily Win8 has a build in antivirus. So that's what I am using now.

Windows 8 you have to create a second USER. And leave the ADMINISTRATOR there for install purposes. The METRO invironment is only working properly on a USER account. Wich is a good thing. But it took me some time to get used to...

I've been using MS Security Essentials from the beginning of using Vista some time ago and haven't had a problem with it. It does do the job without interfering with a DAW setup. In Windows 8 I use the same thing. 

I'm not sure why you need to setup a new user account to use metro apps. Or as they seem to now want to call it the, modern UI. If you think of that as the start button without needing to click a button to access it, I think you may have a better time. On the other hand I use Classic  Shell which is free and brings back the start button.  You can have it bypass the start screen or not as you wish. 

One tip is all four corners have charms either in the desktop or the start screen. The windows key on your keyboard also has a lot of use with win 8.

I only have one user set up on Win 8, and it works fine.

I attached my most frequently accessed programs to the task bar and mostly just stay in the desktop mode - really no problem. Once I finish installing all my my applications (I did a clean install on purpose, rather than an upgrade from Win 7), anyways after installations are done I will go back and figure out how I am 'supposed' to work with the new UI.

I have not had any stability issues with Win 8 as of yet, but do agree that Win 7 seems to be pretty bulletproof - certainly a good platform for Sonar.  Drivers for Win 8 should be researched PRIOR to upgrading to it, in my opinion.

Bob Bone