Jeff Evans


I have mentioned this before but why cannot people simply start a production at 2.01.000 instead of attempting to start at 1.01.000 What is the big deal here, I cannot see it.

Anyone who attempts to start music right on 1.01.000 is tempting fate a bit. For a start, tracks that have been advanced may not get played and when a sequencer actually starts up right on 1.01.000 there are a few tasks that need to be done which might get in the way of music sounding off correctly.

By simply putting your music at 2.01.000 or later you avoid a raft of problems then. I know its nice for printing out music etc to have everything starting at bar 1 but musicians are not fussed about bar numbers in general.

I agree, one problem being with bouncing tracks with vsti's or audio tacks with fx's or any note number info starting directly on 1.01.000
I always set the bounce 'start' pre the initial starting measure or time.

Hi Undertow I agree that it should be the same starting a piece at 1.01.000 or a later time but for some and I am not sure of those reasons myself, it is not the same. With some sequencers I have worked with, I have found that starting right at the very start just kicks off a tiny bit later. Why one could ask. Sonar and Studio One seem to start off the bat at 1.01.00 but even with Sonar I have found that sometimes the very first metronome click wont sound for some reason. I have also had some of my external hardware synths not do something they should have as well at this position. But at all later positions there were no problems. So simply, there is a difference between starting at 1.01.000 and any later time. I wish I knew what it was, but if some things happen or don't happen at 1.01.000 and all is well at a later position then it must be deduced there is a reason.

Jeff Evans


Hi Undertow I agree that it should be the same starting a piece at 1.01.000 or a later time but for some and I am not sure of those reasons myself, it is not the same. With some sequencers I have worked with, I have found that starting right at the very start just kicks off a tiny bit later. Why one could ask. Sonar and Studio One seem to start off the bat at 1.01.00 but even with Sonar I have found that sometimes the very first metronome click wont sound for some reason. I have also had some of my external hardware synths not do something they should have as well at this position. But at all later positions there were no problems. So simply, there is a difference between starting at 1.01.000 and any later time. I wish I knew what it was, but if some things happen or don't happen at 1.01.000 and all is well at a later position then it must be deduced there is a reason.

Strange... As I said, I tend to start at 17 or 33 so I don't encounter this behaviour. Ah well...

UnderTow

F@ker, you are the devil himself!

LOL, my heart almost skipped a beat when I saw your mockup and I was wondering if I could do that in 8.5 (because I've retired X1).

For all you guys who don't see the use of a pre-roll, every guitarist knows that his playing begins significantly before zero. It would be nice to have a one or two measure preroll so that measures would be numbered realistically (instead of with a one or two measure offset. Personally, I want to know that measure one is actually measure one, and so on.

I would like to have the measure number match up with the sheet music, so I can read the sheet music as I listen to playback, and go to measure x where the error is etc.  To do this, I would need to be able to specify negative measure numbers at the beginning.  I support the feature request for a custom offset.

it really does seem simple; when you select an offset, the globally displayed measure would reflect the measure minus the offset, thereafter, any input references to a measure would add the offset respectively; no internal changes, just what is displayed.

SimonFenner


Because musically you are starting in measure 1, but you are not using all of the beats in the measure. If you think about it how can you record music into a measure before measure 1? It's just not possible cos it doesn't exist. So the DAW is not at fault. It's no different to playing live where the drummer gives you a count in and you start before he has completed this!

You'll just have to accept that some of your songs will have some silent beats in measure 1.

  +1 - This supposed "annoyance" never gave anyone a moment's pause before our modern recording programs.  Many pieces of music begin with a pause.  Measure #1 can be, for instance -1-2-3-4-AND (first note/word) then measure 2 starts.  It's incorrect to think that first mostly silent measure isn't part of the piece/song.  And that's why it doesn't make any sense to think a DAW is supposed to somehow completely re- write the history of music and now decide that measure 2 is actually measure 1.  hehe.

Randy B.

rbowser



+1 - This supposed "annoyance" never gave anyone a moment's pause before our modern recording programs.  Many pieces of music begin with a pause.  Measure #1 can be, for instance -1-2-3-4-AND (first note/word) then measure 2 starts.  It's incorrect to think that first mostly silent measure isn't part of the piece/song.  And that's why it doesn't make any sense to think a DAW is supposed to somehow completely re- write the history of music and now decide that measure 2 is actually measure 1.  hehe.

Randy B.

That's not what we're mainly discussing here, AFAIU. Beginning a song with a pause is not the question here. People want to have count-in bars for example to make sure that plugins are "awake" when they're needed or to be able to use a click-track with a count-in or they find it easier to visually follow the start of the recording and for various other reasons.
 
Having bar-numbering follow sheet-music is a strong argument. Also, as I mentioned earlier, when a song follows certain cycle of bars it's easier to cope with when you can follow the bar-numbering you see, without doing extra calculations.
 
There aren't many features that are asked for as freguently as this, and it can not be very difficult to apply.

I had recent experience with this.  I took home the recording to listen for places that needed editing.  I noted them on the score.  I went back to the studio and the engineer said, where is the first edit?  I said, measure 35.  He figured out that would be 38 for him.  And so on, always having to shift the measure number I gave him.  Small thing?  Yes.  Annoyance that need not be?  Yes.

Also, it makes it hard to "guess" how long the piece actually is. And to convince the client that it's actually 30s, not 32s or whatever. +1 for -2 and more :O)