lfm

FastBikerBoy

There is an excellent standard - VST effects and VST instruments!!!!

It would be had they given some thought to automatic GUI display when a track is selected. That is where the PC wins every time for me.


Back to X1...... (and the bike analogy) I actually had more choice as I didn't have to buy them at all but if I chose to improve on the base model that is built to a price. Without that choice the base model would be out of the reach for some in the first place. That's a good thing no?

Sounds like a good feature with GUI autodisplay.

On the other hand, is it hidden for all the tracks that does not use it?

I felt Inspector was cluttered with stuff I don't want to see, like PC and extra column of faders.

As Bristol_Jonesey has pointed out you can have the inspector slim like it was in previous versions. That is also remembered on a per screenset basis. It can also be hidden/called up via the "I" keypress. If you never use the PC you don't bring it to the front simple as that.

It could very well be a good feature request to have gui hidden/minimized of plugins visible when track is not active anymore. You don't need Steinberg involved for that.

They all ready do now, it's just they are within the PC framework

I'm getting the Waves CLA bundle for $196 and that is basically what is core in PC and I can use it in whatever daw I choose.

That's great, you choose those in the same way that I choose the PC modules, there's nothing wrong with either approach. I'm happy for you to do that I'm only concerned that I'm allowed to have my chosen method left alone.

I'm glad there is Sonar SE still, and I'm sticking with that. Hopefully X2 with all customization options one can think of. I still think Sonar 8.x looks more professional.

Looks are a very personal thing, I always managed in previous versions but when I last opened 8.5 it looked very higgledy piggledy to me, almost toy like, and worse still - it hasn't got screensets.

For me personally, it would make sense now for the Cakewalk team to separate the release of new ProChannel stuff from general Sonar X updates/upgrades.  If they've done the infrastructure correctly, they can develop new ProChannel modules at anytime and sell them when available.

If one of the new modules requires some "extended" feature to be added to Sonar X, then they could state "must run Sonar X1.752334" or whatever when attempting to purchasing the module.

So, for me.  The next upgrade of Sonar should be about making the DAW better.

Tom

8.53 may look like a toy but I'm constantly having to use it to do the functions that haven't worked or have been broken in X1. 1. Drag midi effect from clip to bin, or clip to clip. Fatal Crash 2. Can't Fastbounce melodyne or Antares to clip as of X1D (Mel doesn't process at all fastbounce since X1D, Antares doesn't bounce properly. 3. Frozen tracks becoming un-freezable, and non-frozen tracks showing as frozen. 4. +99.9db on tracks when audio snap is on, clips follow project tempo (stretch), online set to groove clip, Change the tempo and then click around the timeline. Horrible distorting sound. (reproducible by cake) 5. Audio snap not displaying the correct snap markers and threshold slider not functioning/swallowing cursor till sonar closed. (Having to audio snap in 8.53) 6. Pro-channel not working as expected. (on but not ON). Not remembering state on frozen tracks. 7. Export audio adds audio left in buffers to front of bounce unless play tails after stopping is checked. (best to clear buffers in a silent spot. These are but a few of the X1Ds troubles. More fatal crashes since X1D. Customer support working on these issues. X1 looks more Pro, but 8.53 acts more Pro. X1 is STILL not ready for primetime, atleast not in REAL world recording where you use those features that no one else's DAW can do to give you the edge. Edge lost. (eg. here, uh, let me just rename this project so I can open it up in the OLD version to do the tuning, time stretching and cool stuff that's been broken in the NEW version)Shame on DAW. Under pressure, X1 cracks like poorly sacked eggs. FIXES PLEASE!!! Thank you bakers, I know you're trying.... try harder.

Working pretty well here in the NON-REAl(TM) recording world. I can't remember the last time X1 crashed on me. Install issues maybe?

lfm

John T


Not this again. How is there "less choice"?

If you're expecting a new interface like Expanded to cover all your needs.
You can sit there and tap your fingers for a year and maybe, just maybe they add what you want.

It's such a clever approach with these VST plugins, why leave it for something else?

There were too many voices wanting Cake to use up developer resources and going down that lane.

Like FastBikerBoy was on to - more options for putting away gui dynamically of VSTs on track by track bases. Me too would like that for a certain phase of work. Toggle option with keyboard shortcut by track.

Such improvements to make life easier is what Cake should focus on - in my view. Not new plugin interfaces.

I always find it odd when someone quotes a question, and then writes a long reply, none of which addresses the question at all.
 
Again, how is there "less choice"? Previously, you could mix and match your own effects choices out of VSTs. Since ProChannel, you can still mix and match your own effects choices out of VSTs.
 
What choices were available before that now aren't?

Install issues maybe?

Sounds like it to me.

My system is blowing 8.5.3 out of the water.

I wish it was install issues and NOT reproducible by cakewalk.....but if they can reproduce it, it's not an install issue.

FastBikerBoy

There is an excellent standard - VST effects and VST instruments!!!!

It would be had they given some thought to automatic GUI display when a track is selected. That is where the PC wins every time for me.

I don't buy the painted myself in a corner bit either. I'm fully aware that should I ever decide to move DAWs I won't be using the PC modules. I'd say that was part of the marketing strategy,  one users can choose to buy into or not.

I spent £9000 on a new bike then another £1500 on 'extras' - rear sets, double bubble, exhaust system etc. - When I changed bikes and found out the extras wouldn't fit the new updated model (by the same manufacturer) was I furious? Of course not - I accepted that was the likely outcome at time of purchase.

Back to X1...... (and the bike analogy) I actually had more choice as I didn't have to buy them at all but if I chose to improve on the base model that is built to a price. Without that choice the base model would be out of the reach for some in the first place. That's a good thing no?

i tryed to be good but one point you are missing .your bike parts can still be resold. like the ones i have beside my house ,along with car part i got 500 bucks, where talking about, code DATA 0-1 this is nothing, its not a object.
 but the guys that write core code are top notch, cakewalk is far superior than anything iv worked with.
 but its a daw unsellable. and where talking about a plugin that once finished sits on a server,you wont be bringing your virual toolbox anywhere cus in reality you own a code, nothing more.so to answer your post, when you got the new bike you know in the back of you head that there is many folks who could use the unused part.good luck taking a softtube mod  made for 1 product to ebay like you can any object known to man. so what do biike's brownies,sound card you name it. and you could own it,.
at least my t-racks stuff can go for the ride to another daw on my flash drive. with 2 hours of updates, but these new cakewalk products do nothing more that make shure they make more, and thats not bad,this issue is about content for software, and how they sell it,

John T

lfm

John T


Not this again. How is there "less choice"?

If you're expecting a new interface like Expanded to cover all your needs.
You can sit there and tap your fingers for a year and maybe, just maybe they add what you want.

It's such a clever approach with these VST plugins, why leave it for something else?

There were too many voices wanting Cake to use up developer resources and going down that lane.

Like FastBikerBoy was on to - more options for putting away gui dynamically of VSTs on track by track bases. Me too would like that for a certain phase of work. Toggle option with keyboard shortcut by track.

Such improvements to make life easier is what Cake should focus on - in my view. Not new plugin interfaces.

I always find it odd when someone quotes a question, and then writes a long reply, none of which addresses the question at all.
 
Again, how is there "less choice"? Previously, you could mix and match your own effects choices out of VSTs. Since ProChannel, you can still mix and match your own effects choices out of VSTs.
 
What choices were available before that now aren't?

Well, I always find it odd that people comment without making a quote at all, just an empty post and I had to guess comment was about my post

This is what my comments was about:
"What I also think they ought to do is add more features to Expanded to get more users onto Expanded along with the great promotions they run. Initially, I didn't think much about Expanded and didn't buy into it because of the few features it offered."

Which I quoted.

I objected to putting so much effort into painting users into a corner - and people seems to like it, not having a look through what is in VST market and keeping independence.

Cake says:
- jump

and everybody jumps....

...sort of....

So how "less choice"?
#1. If focus would have been VST there would have been VST3 support already, I'm sure. Expanded and PC takes focus of their improvements to the realm that is painting users into a corner, as I put it.

So we cannot choose VST3 plugins!!!!

#2. One important reason for Fastbikerboy was that PC was activated when a track is activated, not taking valuable space and having to minimize plugins gui to get rid of them.

Me, not having focus on PC, immediately felt this could be improved greatly with very little effort for VST plugins as well.

If Cake had focus on VST plugins they would already had implemented this feature for VST plugins.

This is just the beginning of missing features for VST, if all focus is elsewhere.

#3. The fact that further development of PC and Expanded is Sonar only territory is decreasing choice for users getting acustomed to that. You cannot switch to another daw with the investments you made in Expanded stuff.

To switch daw you have to switch all the tools you are acustomed to as well, and learn these new tools.

Another example of painting yourself into a corner.

If we encourage Cake to put resources into developing this new plugin interface - well, you will suffer the consequences after some years doing that.

Don't see how you can be "sure" there would be VST3 support, that's nothing but speculation. And currently, the number of VST3-only plug-ins around is not huge. There's a case for adding it of course, but not adding it hasn't *shrunk* the choices available. And you also have the choice to *not* invest in the expanded stuff, if you prefer not to.