• SONAR
  • SFZ files for EX Drummer samples? (p.2)
2012/07/22 15:16:54
pdarg
Yes I agree. It's not worth the time and effort.
 
But I DO like those Platinum Samples - so i think I will get those instead - thanks for the tip.
2012/07/23 10:53:51
chuckebaby
im sorry it just sounds a little policing to me,its not piracy,the samples are paid for.
is it against toontracks policy?..well i guess youve made that clear.
is there a problem you ask ??

i guess not dave.

im sure toontrack is greatful for your extended service.
2012/07/23 11:37:46
David
seriously,  He asked for others files.
   just a no-no ,  Toontrack  does not  sell the samples by themselves , would you want your product changes like that
and passed around the internet?
    Just leads to piracy!
2012/07/24 01:37:50
SToons
What an absurd thread. Pdarg could do nothing with the SFZ files unless he already possessed the samples so clearlly this is not the issue.
 
Sharing mapping to samples does not promote piracy, that's a ridiculous statement.
 
Sending Pdarg SFZ files is hardly "reverse engineering". Doing what -I- did, modifying Steven Slates drums and posting those SFZ files here publicly on the forum, is perhaps a little closer to reverse engineering but still not even close to qualifying. Let's add the fact people publicly complained and reported me about that thread yet not one word from Cakewalk or a moderator. Does that sound like Cakewalk was upset about my "copyright infringement" or "reverse engineering"?
 
In the next two weeks I will be posting almost ten reworked, bastardized, edited and vastly improved versions of the SFZ files for Steven Slates Old Zep kit. It is quite surprising to hear the improvements I've made. I trust all those complaining in this thread will refrain from downloading and using the superior sounding kit, despite the fact they have already paid for the samples and were given sub-standard, poorly edited and essentially non-functional mapping rendering said samples pretty much useless, and I hope all others will download and benefit from the improvements. I'll let you know when the cease and desist letters show up.
 
I understand protecting intellectual property but there becomes a point where common sense should prevail.
 
EDIT: OK, so I apologize. This thread is actually offensive, not just absurd. I realize now Pdarg is actually asking if someone has -already- remapped the samples to SFZ for SD3 and asking them to share the mappings if they would. To object to others sharing mappings they have created themselves is bizarre, trivial, and possibly inaccurate in terms of legality.... if any company told me I could not remap samples I purchased from them I would not only ignore them but they would never see a penny of investment from me ever again. YMMV.
 
Mod Bod - please quote me the specific refrain from the user agreement that would oppose someone remapping the samples to be used in a different sampler for their own purpose. This I would like to see, and since you are making direct claim that this is in violation of the user agreement then you have already found and read the specific section as you have clearly made a legal determination. Therefore, surely you can also take the time to produce the section that pertains to the issue. Or is quoting the user agreement copyright infringement too?
 
 
2012/07/24 02:06:16
SToons
Glyn Barnes


pdarg


????????

As I said - I PURCHASED EZ Drummer some time ago - what is the issue?
You would need to read the licensing conditions, I don't have then to hand. Its pretty common to have a clause preventing the reverse engineering of software. Remapping the samples to a third party application would effectively give you a way of bypassing Toontrack's licensing control, so they are unlikely to approve. 
 


How is remapping the samples a legal violation of the agreement? Please quote.
2012/07/24 03:35:56
SToons
SToons
Mod Bod - please quote me the specific refrain from the user agreement that would oppose someone remapping the samples to be used in a different sampler for their own purpose. This I would like to see, and since you are making direct claim that this is in violation of the user agreement then you have already found and read the specific section as you have clearly made a legal determination. Therefore, surely you can also take the time to produce the section that pertains to the issue. Or is quoting the user agreement copyright infringement too?
 
 
Nevermind, found it myself.
 
Quote:
"7. LIMITATION ON REVERSE ENGINEERING, DECOMPILING, COPYING AND DISASSEMBLY. You may NOT reverse engineer, decompile, copy or disassemble the Product. Customization of the libraries is bound by this clause and failure to comply will free Toontrack Music AB from its obligation to support the product. "

Remapping is not reverse engineering. Remapping is not decompiling. Remapping is not copying. Remapping is not disassembling. Remapping is not customizing the library.
 
So much for your legal advice.
2012/07/24 11:12:13
David
SToons-I have found your posts on SFZ files very informative but I think this is a different thing, when the samples are inside a 
  program and not sold separately. I guess we will have to ask Toontrack themselves. 
      
      
2012/07/24 11:28:49
Dave Modisette
SToons


Glyn Barnes


pdarg


????????

As I said - I PURCHASED EZ Drummer some time ago - what is the issue?
You would need to read the licensing conditions, I don't have then to hand. Its pretty common to have a clause preventing the reverse engineering of software. Remapping the samples to a third party application would effectively give you a way of bypassing Toontrack's licensing control, so they are unlikely to approve. 
 


How is remapping the samples a legal violation of the agreement? Please quote.

No, I don't see any purpose to further discuss this issue.  I don't think that I could change your mind because it seems you want to split hairs over the wording of the user agreement.

On a positive note, Platinum Samples has a great interest in serving the users of Session Drummer and he is making his sample sets available to the users of Session Drummer 3.  The kits are very good and they work well in SD3 within the limitations of that product.

EZdrummer samples work the best in the context of Toontrack Samplers.  You will never get the same quality result using the Session Drummer 3 product and the EZX libraries.  So why do all that work for a lesser result.
2012/07/24 15:53:25
SToons
This is not an issue of splitting hairs. It's a silly issue to begin with, but -you- started it by making what amounts to legal threats or warnings and it warrants being addressed.
 
The legalese is actually very clear. In the opening paragraphs:
Quote: "The Product contains the following parts:
 
The EZDrummer software instrument is the software tool supplied for programming of customized sounds otherwise referred to as the EZD/EZX sound libraries. The software and the sounds provided together form the product and all limitations and/or agreements that you make when installing this product on your computer apply to the product as a whole.
 
This binds the software and sounds as "The Product".
 
This is the only section that deals with our discussion:
Quote: "You may NOT reverse engineer, decompile, copy or disassemble the Product. Customization of the libraries is bound by this clause and failure to comply will free Toontrack Music AB from its obligation to support the product. Customization of the libraries is bound by this clause and failure to comply will free Toontrack Music AB from its obligation to support the product."
 
Reverse engineering and decompiling refer to the software as any programmer can attest to. Copying is self-evident. Disassembling is a bit obtuse as The Product already comes disassembled unless they are again referring to the software. However it is the final sentence we are concerned with.
 
"Customization of the libraries is bound by this clause and failure to comply will free Toontrack Music AB from its obligation to support the product."
 
This statement -clearly- differentiates between "The Libraries" and "The Product". Customization of the "Library" (not the software element) would include things like normalizing or otherwise altering the "Library" itself. However it -clearly- states that this would result is a lack of support for "The Product", not in the termination of the EULA. Of course this makes sense - if you map all the samples to Battery why would TT give you technical or other support? If you contacted TT and told them you normalized the samples and now the balance between dry/room etc. were messed up inside "The Product" then of course they have no obligation to give you technical support.
 
There is absolutely nothing to suggest that mapping the samples ("The Library") inside another program is in violation of the EULA.
 
I fully agree that it would be a tremendous task to remap these samples into SD3, although the "quality" of SD3 is no lower tha EZDrummer, it is simply more convoluted to edit the programming of the samples. This, however, does not negate the issue that perhaps people should be a little more careful before making accusations of impropriety.
2012/07/24 16:10:39
bapu
Man, what a drag. I'm out of popcorn.
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