• SONAR
  • LatencyMon: Anybody here used it? (p.2)
2017/10/03 17:32:23
gbowling
gswitz
Don't miss out on RME DigiCheck. Very cool and useful tool.



I'll 2nd this advice. I use DigiCheck to set levels when doing a session instead of using Sonar or TotalMix. Very nice tool and you can set the meters to K-14 which I find much better for getting proper levels. 
 
gabo
2017/10/04 15:42:17
bitflipper
Page faults are usually not relevant to audio performance except in very specific scenarios, e.g. if you have too little RAM, or you have a memory leak, in which case page fault monitoring might point those problems out. But interpreting the significance of observed page faults is tricky - lots of them do not necessarily indicate a problem.
 
But if you're just curious, page faults can be measured via Windows' own Performance Monitor. Run "perfmon.exe /sys", right-click and select "Add counters" from the context menu. From the dialog, select "page faults per second" under the "Memory" category. Don't be surprised if you see high PF/s numbers, especially if you monitor them while loading a SONAR project. What you're looking for is for those numbers to level out after a bit; if they stay high then you may have a problem with insufficient available memory.
2017/10/04 18:15:13
azslow3
When LatencyMon indicates some problem ("red"), DAWs have hard time to work with reasonable settings. So that is an essential tool to check the system readiness. But note that is not always sufficient tool to understand all audio related problems.
 
btw I use relatively old version on Win10 with all updates, works fine...
2017/10/04 18:44:20
Cactus Music
My gripe about it was when I ran it a few weeks ago to see why Sonar was crashing it did go red and it told me I needed to disable Speed stepping ( ?) in the BIOS, so I did and then my computer blue screened on the next boot and asked if I would kindly re set the BIOS to defaults. So I did and all was good. Sonar continues to crash for no reason. Latency monitor goes down to almost nothing as long as I disable my Network. 
Why do they have that notice about the speed stepping in the text when it warns you,, it would be better if they told you nothing. 
I liked the old Latency Monitor that ran in real time, to bad they never ported it over to W 10. 
It was cool because you could keep it running while you disabled stuff. 
Back then in XP the minute I turned on my Tascam us1641 it would fly up to the orange and stay there.. That's why I bought my Scarlett, Tascam driver where obviously garbage back then.
2017/10/06 00:56:40
...wicked
Funny, when I try and launch this program it opens and is present in my taskbar but I can't bring up the UI. It just doesn't show.
 
BUT, when I click on the "in depth latency tests" shortcut it also creates that opens up what looks like a limited UI, which doesn't have many of the tabs present that I See in videos. What am I doing wrong?
 
2017/10/06 16:59:39
abacab
I typically see a large number of page faults when running LatencyMon, but I am not experiencing any audio dropouts, and the test otherwise stays in the green for me.
 
That said, I think the term "page faults" is a bad choice of language for something that occurs in normal operation on a modern computer.  It just means that you are using your page file (virtual memory).
 
It all depends on what is being swapped to your page file that could cause audio issues.
 
Here is a quote from the developer, worth reading ...
 
About hard pagefaults
"Windows uses a concept of virtual memory which relies on the page translation system provided by the CPU. Whenever a memory address is requested which is not available in physical memory (not resident), an INT 14 will occur. The OS provided INT 14 handler will decide how to proceed next. If the page in which the address resides is known to Windows but not resident, Windows will read in the required page from the page file. That is known as a hard pagefault and can take a lot of time to complete. If the page can be read in from the hard disk cache, the price will be limited. However if it needs to physically read in the data from disk sectors this takes a lot of time. If an audio program hits a hard pagefault while it is playing it will almost certainly have audible consequences recognized as dropouts, clicks or pops. 

Hard pagefaults are a very common but often overlooked cause of audio dropouts, clicks and pops. They especially occur often with audio software that uses a lot of memory such as samplers. Solutions for avoiding hard pagefaults are increasing the working set of the audio application, increasing the amount of RAM or disabling the pagefile altogether. Note that if you disable the pagefile, the system may run "out of memory" because it does not have the pagefile available to swap memory to. Also the system will no longer create crash dump files in case of a system crash."

2017/10/06 20:11:38
riojazz
Vas
Is there a good alternative to Latency Mon or other utility to use for audio computers? 

The free DPC Latency Checker used to be a great alternative.  The website gives easy-to-follow instructions that are a good read even if you don't use the utility.  It still works but is best on Windows 7.  For more recent versions of Windows (8, 8.1 and 10) it gives readings that are unnecessarily high.  They are aware of this but haven't updated it.  By reading high, it is misleading but actually more effective as a test,
 
By reading high, it is misleading but actually more effective as a test, because if you are still in the green, with less cushion, you should really be fine for digital audio.
 
2017/10/06 21:03:56
Vas
 
DPC Latency Checker
http://www.thesycon.de/eng/latency_check.shtml 
Stopped using it as W10 was not officially supported.
Hope to try it later.
 
2017/10/06 22:07:11
bitflipper
abacab
... think the term "page faults" is a bad choice of language for something that occurs in normal operation on a modern computer.  


Yeah, it's one of those terms that's been around since the 50's and has confused computer science students ever since. Kind of like the word "argument" (meaning data pushed onto the stack to be read by called functions), which sounds unnecessarily aggressive. But "fault" is technically correct, as it refers to a process that fails to complete (e.g. trying to load data from cache or the paging device that isn't there), requiring mitigating action. Failures can be expected or unexpected, rare or routine, but they all result in triggering a fault handler. 
 
2017/10/06 22:35:22
abacab
bitflipper
abacab
... think the term "page faults" is a bad choice of language for something that occurs in normal operation on a modern computer.  


Yeah, it's one of those terms that's been around since the 50's and has confused computer science students ever since. Kind of like the word "argument" (meaning data pushed onto the stack to be read by called functions), which sounds unnecessarily aggressive. But "fault" is technically correct, as it refers to a process that fails to complete (e.g. trying to load data from cache or the paging device that isn't there), requiring mitigating action. Failures can be expected or unexpected, rare or routine, but they all result in triggering a fault handler. 
 




"Contrary to what "fault" might suggest, valid page faults are not errors, and are common and necessary to increase the amount of memory available to programs in any operating system that utilizes virtual memory".
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Page_fault
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