2017/08/04 21:39:12
konradh
I normally use Synthogy Ivory II, German D (Steinway) for piano.  It sounds great, but I don't feel like I quite get the bell-like clarity I am looking for. Very close,  but I am not 100% happy.
 
Of course, you will say "it all depends," but does anyone have a particular starting EQ that works well for a large grand?  This would be generally for pop or Broadway-type music, but I only say that to clarify that I am not looking for a hard or thin rock/country sound--just sweet, clear, and not muddy.
 
Thanks.
2017/08/04 21:40:31
konradh
PS The Ivory Yamaha does not have enough sustain or depth, and the Bosendorfer has too much midrange.  I always go back to Steinway.
2017/08/04 21:56:32
Bristol_Jonesey
Probably one of the most successful EQ settings i used on piano was the 'Tilt' preset in the Sonitus.
 
It does exactly what you think, starts with a low shelf and gradually tilts upwards to a gentle rise in the high end
2017/08/05 01:13:55
bitflipper
Pianos will nearly always have resonances to deal with. Use the trusty band-sweep method to identify them. Create a bandpass filter, set it to a narrow Q and boost it way, way up. The piano will now sound awful. Sweep the filter back and forth until you find the spot where it sounds the absolute worst, which is often between 800 and 1500 Hz, or around 4 KHz. Then widen the band a little and change its gain to a negative value, -3 to -6 dB is usually enough but it might take more - just don't make it so negative that it starts sounding thin. Even the annoying frequencies have to be in there for a full sound.
 
Piano trick #2 is the air band, up above 8-10 KHz. A little boost up there can help definition, but it depends on the samples. On some libraries, it just gets plinky. And if the samples don't have a lot of high frequency content to begin with, this won't help anything.
 
Piano trick #3: HPF. This will depend on where your piano sits in the mix. If it's the main featured instrument, don't bother. But if it's more of a rhythm instrument competing against guitars, roll off that bottom below ~100 Hz. I often have piano intros in my songs, so I automate the HPF to give the piano full range for the intro and then slip down into the mix.
 
Piano trick #4: compression. I know, that's sacrilege if you're a piano player, but it can help with sustain. You can also use the sidechain filter (if your compressor has one) to soften the hammer noise. 
2017/08/05 01:38:39
tenfoot
Bitflipper nailed it - pretty much the perfect approach IMHO.
2017/08/05 02:02:30
gswitz
Real pianos don't sound like the pianos in midi libraries to me. At least when I record them. To get a real piano near a midi piano I need super responsive mics and lots of high end boost.
2017/08/05 02:52:21
ryecatchermark
Hi, I use Synthogy Ivory II as well. I think the Steinway is my favourite too. Have you tried experimenting with the different Keysets? Some of the harder Keysets give a brighter attack without sounding thin and tinny like the Yamaha Grand. -Mark.
2017/08/05 16:15:54
konradh
Great stuff, guys. Thank you.
2017/08/07 13:39:20
michael japan
I have spent literally hours working on digital pianos recording them on 100's of songs and probably have just about every piano library there is (Ivory/Play Quantum Leap Gold. Pianoteq -and all the older ones.) I have abandoned all of them. I much prefer the Yamaha Motif XS, S90es, Clavinova pianos. Much more full bodied. I can send you some samples of the sound. Of course, a Motif or Motif XS Rack or Clavinova (except the old Clavinovas which are cheap  and sound great - I use one as a controller CLP 170.) is a lot more expensive but if you play a lot of piano I think you will be more satisfied with an outboard Yamaha unit. Send me a sample of what you have and I'll send you some. Yes, it has driven me crazy. Or better yet, send me a bun a midi file of your playing, an mp3 of what it sounds like, and I'll send you an mp3 back of the Motif. A lot more body. I have even gone so far as to run my piano through a good sub and mic that sub while I am recording my take -or just play my take back through it afterwards.
 
There is however no solution sad to say. It's digital. But you know that.
 
As far as the eq, I do usually cut a slow curve from around 250 all the way up to 4k, and boost around 50 to 100 on the lo end and add air at the top -usually around 12k.
2017/08/07 13:59:20
konradh
Interesting, Michael, and thanks for the kind offer.  FYI, I do have a Yamaha Tyros 2.  Not sure if it is the same sample set as the Motif and Clavinova, but I think so.
 
To me, Ivory II sounds exactly like a real Steinway (which it is).  It is real samples with 20 velocity layers. I have played many model Ds in auditoriums and studios.  Many studios, however, spend a lot of time setting up graphic EQ to optimize the piano sound (in my experience).
 
I guess it is a personal thing but I bought Ivory because I did not like the outboard sounds.  
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