• SONAR
  • Sonar really needs a sampler. (p.32)
2017/08/12 11:53:06
cyberzip
I think a new and modern integrated sampler would be great addition to Sonar. A sampler built-in into Sonar could be integrated in the GUI in ways that 3rd party VSTs never could.
 
For inspiration, check out how the samplers are integrated in Cubase and Live:
 
Sampler Track | New Features in Cubase Pro 9
https://youtu.be/ko8pWheSufg?t=43s
 
10 Reasons You Should Be Using Sampler [Ableton Tips]
https://youtu.be/ZlX9-d3Asd8?t=5m43s
2017/08/12 12:53:15
Sanderxpander
Simpler is amazingly useful and quick. While I appreciate the many ways you can accomplish the same (or a similar) effect in Sonar, workflow matters. I think the people who don't appreciate this simply don't produce EDM or hiphop very much. Similarly, many Ableton users don't get why grouped clips and take comping are so important. The right tool for the right job, and all that. But I agree with Dub that Sonar could easily take a major jump in EDM/Hiphop production with the inclusion of a simple, tightly integrated sampler. Perhaps even some "macros" would work. You know, a "slice 16ths to Session Drummer command", or a "make Rapture instrument" kind of thing. As said, it's mostly not the lack of functionality but the speed of process.
2017/08/12 19:03:22
Anderton
I think the Matrix view could get people 85% there with a couple mods. I use Audiosnap to slice stuff and drag slices into Matrix View cells, then play the slices in real time. To go beyond the MV's performance orientation, you'd need to be able to route a MIDI track (not just MIDI remote control) to the Matrix View.
2017/08/12 22:08:50
Sanderxpander
After spending half an hour trying to build a really simple vocal lead sound with the much too complicated Kontakt, I'm all the more convinced a basic, quick-workflow sampler would be a great boon. This would've been done in 20 seconds with Simpler by the way but I needed it to be cross-platform.
 
Who knew that simple legato portamento was not possible with the regular Kontakt engine (what a weird omission?!), instead you need a script (thankfully a factory one).
2017/08/13 01:15:49
dubdisciple
Sanderxpander
Simpler is amazingly useful and quick. While I appreciate the many ways you can accomplish the same (or a similar) effect in Sonar, workflow matters. I think the people who don't appreciate this simply don't produce EDM or hiphop very much. Similarly, many Ableton users don't get why grouped clips and take comping are so important. The right tool for the right job, and all that. But I agree with Dub that Sonar could easily take a major jump in EDM/Hiphop production with the inclusion of a simple, tightly integrated sampler. Perhaps even some "macros" would work. You know, a "slice 16ths to Session Drummer command", or a "make Rapture instrument" kind of thing. As said, it's mostly not the lack of functionality but the speed of process.

very well put.  
2017/08/14 04:07:54
shawn@trustmedia.tv
where can i download BeatScape? i own it... - s
2017/08/14 05:15:28
ljb500
Anderton
I think the Matrix view could get people 85% there with a couple mods. I use Audiosnap to slice stuff and drag slices into Matrix View cells, then play the slices in real time. To go beyond the MV's performance orientation, you'd need to be able to route a MIDI track (not just MIDI remote control) to the Matrix View.


I was playing with this just yesterday doing the same thing and using my mpd to trigger samples, it could work but really needs an option to map the slices straight across the cells like in ableton with drum maps or cubase with groove agent. Also need a few more editing options etc. and I think it could be workable. Also an ability to create templates for cell layout and behaviour would be very useful.

The other option would be to be able to play/map slices from an acid loop directly to a midi keyboard same as in ableton simpler, if you had the option to do this directly from the loop construction window and add in a few extra editing options I think you'd be on to a winner. This is something you can even do in Ableton lite so i can't believe that sonar doesn't offer something similar tbh.
2017/08/14 21:11:19
KPerry
Didn't the old Cyclone do something like that (I may well be misremembering to be honest)?
2017/08/14 21:18:54
sharke
A large part of the DAW market these days is kids who want to make hip hop or EDM or other electronic based modern styles in their bedrooms on their laptops. And I think where Sonar loses out is that before these kids have even chosen a DAW, they are searching for things like "how to make a beat" on YouTube and they're watching a bunch of cool tutorials which show how to do it easily using stock tools in DAW's like Ableton and FL. So by the time they've watched a few of those to whet their appetites, they've already made up their mind which DAW they want, and it's not Sonar.

Most of these kids are struggling to afford a DAW in the first place - they're often relying on their parents to buy it for their birthday or Christmas present, or they've saved up (that's if they're not torrenting it). So they're not really receptive to the idea that they're going to have to spend another $100+ to buy a plugin which replicates the functionality of what you can do in FL without spending another cent. Personally I'd love to see an addition like this to Sonar, even though I own some great 3rd party drum and sampling tools. I'd like to see some good tutorial videos out there competing with Ableton and FL and showing kids how easy it is to get a "banging" beat going in Sonar. God knows Sonar comes with enough drum samples in its library (at least I presume it still does).
2017/08/14 21:28:45
Anderton
sharke
A large part of the DAW market these days is kids who want to make hip hop or EDM or other electronic based modern styles in their bedrooms on their laptops. And I think where Sonar loses out is that before these kids have even chosen a DAW, they are searching for things like "how to make a beat" on YouTube and they're watching a bunch of cool tutorials which show how to do it easily using stock tools in DAW's like Ableton and FL. So by the time they've watched a few of those to whet their appetites, they've already made up their mind which DAW they want, and it's not Sonar.



I agree that what you're describing is an extremely likely scenario. If SONAR could add features that help people make/compose music, and do so in a way that would be comfortable to both the "beats" people and the more traditional recording folks, I think that would help retain existing users and possibly even get some new ones (specifically, the people who find "beats"-oriented programs overly limiting past a certain point).
 
To me, programs like FL Studio are designed more for a "composer" mentality whereas SONAR, Pro Tools, etc. are designed more for a "player" mentality.
 
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