2014/07/31 17:43:06
bayoubill
I've been using this chord type alot lately as a sub for Dom 7 alt chords. How would you guys classify the function of a Minor 7 #5 Chord?
2014/07/31 18:21:34
pentimentosound
OOOPS I didn't have my glasses on! So Excuse this minor7 flat 5 rant. See below.....
 
For me the simplest use is to think of it as a 9th/3( G9/B =G 9th chord over a B bass), ie Bm7b5 works great as a movement/stepping up from G or G7(so the root of your minor7 flat5 goes on the 3rd of whatever your Dominant 7th chord is. So I think of it as a lift to a leading tone chord (ie  G7 to C in the key of C)
 
One of the most common uses of it would be on the #4 or b5 position, like in God Only Knows where Bb minor7 flat5 "pushes or leads into" ( on the phrase "sure about it") Amaj7th of the chorus. This same use occurs in Cole Porters Night and Day (I'll have to check the lyrics to indicate where/when this one shows up), though it goes into a 4 minor (vs a 4 major).
 
In Clapton's Change the World or Because by the Beatles it is used as 2 chord following a 1 minor chord. Both of these examples happen to use C#m into D#m7 flat 5 going to G#7.
 
So, if you're using it in A minor, then 2 = Bm7 flat5 and it leads to E7, where you might have been playing D minor instead.
 
I like using them- the Dominant 7 #5, as a variation on the augmented chord. They add some spike-y ness to an already edge-y chord. So, switching from an A7 or A aug to an A7 #5 sounds pushy to me. I love how they are used in Spanish guitar music and latin stuff.
 
If you use it on the 2nd degree of the scale, it really emphasizes things and then you can use it again, on the 5 chord. It's like a 9th chord on the 5th degree, but sharp -up a fret, so it slides into the 5th nicely and then you can sharp the 5 of that one, too!
 
The Minor 7 #5 always feels "temporary". I don't think of using it much, but mostly use it as part of some kind of movement "during" that chord.
 
Nice work on your Falling Leaves track, and great tone on the guitar.
Michael
 
2014/07/31 19:15:30
sharke
I would think an Am7#5 chord would lead nicely into a Dm chord because the #5 is also the b3 of the Dm. But like Michael says, it's probably more commonly used as movement in an m7 chord. Definitely not one of the most commonly used chords.
 
I tell you who would probably be able to tell you everything you needed to know about m7#5 chords. Ted Greene (if he were still alive).
2014/07/31 19:59:50
bayoubill
Thank you for listening Michael!!!
 
 
I have Chord Chemistry here somewhere. It is a ii7 chord sub. I really like the sound of that chord and use it quite a bit on my original tunes. It has it's own sound. You can put it in between chords as a dom 7 sub just about anywhere. It's a modern sound to me. I don't use a 4th in the chord cuz it makes it sound like a minor 7 over the 5th. (D-7/A) Oh well, breaks over so BACK TO WORK! 
2014/07/31 20:11:33
pentimentosound
I don't have my copy anymore and want to get one. I see them around which seems really weird to me, though I don't know why my is gone.....either.
 
Michael
2014/07/31 21:25:56
bayoubill
I lived with that book when it came out in 71' or 72'. I wore out the pages. I did end up reordering it and I look though it every once in a while. I need it again 
2014/07/31 22:15:29
sharke
I think I've bought Chord Chemistry 3 times....and yet it's currently nowhere to be seen. I've got a copy of Modern Chord Progressions though. 
 
There's a Ted Greene clinic on YouTube. Regardless of what you may or may not learn from this, it has to be said that he was a mesmerizing guy to listen to, and his guitar playing was absolutely beautiful. 
 

2014/08/01 08:42:42
pentimentosound
@sharke    I've watched that one a few times, but really like the ones where he just plays at a wedding. Such a masterful knowing his way around any tune!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZENkj7C7Bw
Michael
2014/08/01 08:58:29
DeeringAmps
Don't forget, music "theory" is what lesser players/writers use to "explain" the things that "better" writers/players do.
Just sayin'...
At my age, music theory, like math, just makes my head hurt!
Tom
2014/08/01 09:33:31
pentimentosound
I don't think about it, I hear it, and that makes it enjoyable, for me!
Michael
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