2018/08/10 21:34:18
Thedoccal
...but I want one that probably doesn't exist.
 
I want one that will allow me to run 16+ usb devices including several usb audio capable keyboards.
I want one that will at the same time run firewire audio.
I want one that will also let me run the onboard audio card through it's own speaker system.
I want it all to be available without having to shut down and reboot or change any settings.
 
I want a motherboard that is built for music production, not gaming, or video rendering.
I can't find any Youtube videos that address this need...multiple audio.
 
I know I know.  Drivers.  Drivers.  Drivers.
But why is this still an issue in our new, advanced musical technology environment?
2018/08/10 21:40:58
Jim Roseberry
The reason you won't find an "Audio specific" motherboard is pretty simple.
DAW users are a miniscule part of the overall market-share.
The general-purpose and gaming segments *dwarf* our segment.
You've probably noticed that most hardware is marketed to "nerdy teenage males".
That's not by accident...  
 
Some motherboards are excellent for use as a DAW.
Some (of course) are not...
2018/08/10 22:34:59
abacab
Well said! 
2018/08/11 16:56:49
Thedoccal
Good.  So the technology exists, but there is not enough of a market for a motherboard company to spend the time making one.  That's fixable.  It's called Kickstarter.  Raise $100,000, then partner with a motherboard company to design and print off 100 of them.  I may just do that.
 
There are 1000 other studio users who are looking to get into the Threadripper craze right now, but what stops someone like me is the fact that I have zero confidence that a new computer will let me use audio freely and confidently.  Graphics cards, USB3, RAM, and PCIe slots enjoy this luxury.  It is now audio's turn.
 
What I mean is this:
I have a Yamaha MOX that can stream usb audio
I have a Korg M3 that can stream Firewire audio
I have a mixer that can stream usb and Firewire audio
I have three Zoom mixers that can all stream usb audio
I have web cam that can record usb audio and video and
a Camlink that can do the same.
And I have the motherboard audio.
 
As it stands now, I can only use one or two of these devices at once without running into all sorts of problems.
I want to be able to use them all at once, or at least the first three all at once. 
 
Some sort of control panel that manages all these devices in one place (like the asio4all panel does) would be a must.  That might have to be another Kickstarter.
 
I think this is probably impossible...but I wouldn't know for sure.
 
 
2018/08/11 18:38:51
BobF
The problem with USB audio devices being used concurrently isn't a motherboard problem.  It's an ASIO problem.
 
I also have a lot of USB audio devices and it is a PITA that only one can be used by any instance of an audio application at a time.  My system is configured with the motherboard audio as the default for Windows, while my DAW(s) use my UMC1820.  I handle the routing with a Samson C-Control so that they can be routed to my speakers or turned off without making changes in Windows.
 
It a big disappointment that my GT-001, THR10 or Roland FA06 can be used for recording via USB while continuing to use the 1820.    Instead, I'm forced to take analog audio out of them into the 1820.  Unfortunately, this can't be corrected with a motherboard design change alone.
2018/08/11 18:40:42
GaryMedia
I just finished working on an article in which I was running the same three audio functions; Dante Virtual Soundcard, Midas DN32-USB, and a Dante AVIO-USB in both macOS and Windows 10.  
 
My machine has a firewire Echo AudioFire Pre8 and 10 USB devices; two are audio.  The constraints of Windows ASIO and Windows Audio Device made changing between these a rather clumsy and error-prone situation. As you have correctly stated, it's drivers; specifically multi-client drivers and the sound subsystem architecture. 
 
Although I've never used it, it seems that the VoiceMeeter product [ https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/ ] is your best way forward for doing what you want in a Windows environment. 
 
2018/08/12 04:36:44
Thedoccal
It looks like a combination of
Virtual Audio Cable,
https://www.vb-audio.com/Cable/index.htm
 
and Banana (or Voicemeeter),
https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/banana.htm
https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/
 
could be the ticket.
 
Using VoiceMeeter as the sound card source in Sonar, Cubase, Studio One etc
And then switching sound sources in the Voicemeeter drop down menu,
(Voicemeeter will be managing the drivers and not the DAW)
Would certainly take the strain off of DAW driver switching management.
If it manages them well enough.
 
It looks like Banana will let me use a DAW and two Keyboard USB audio sources simultaneously.
Will test this out tomorrow.  This is certainly worth a try.
 
If it works it makes sense to get a new computer.
 
2018/08/12 11:17:06
fireberd
Market determines devices and availability.  Just as Jim Roseberry stated about motherboards is also true for us Pedal Steel Guitar players.  Probably 10000 to 1 (maybe larger) ratio for 6 string guitar players to Pedal Steel Guitar players. None of the mass market musical instrument companies (e.g. Fender) make a Pedal Steel Guitar, its all small boutique builders.   There are very few amps and other devices designed specifically for Pedal Steel Guitar.  We have to use general "guitar" devices (e.g. effects processsors and stomp boxes) and many of those are not very good for use with Pedal Steel.  Peavey and Quilter are the only two mass market amp companies that make an amp aimed at Pedal Steel Guitar (I have a Quilter "Steelaire" rack amp).  I use an old POD X3 for effects only (no amp modeling) but had to develop my own effects chains as the built in factory effects were all useless.
2018/08/12 12:14:52
BobF
Thedoccal
It looks like a combination of
Virtual Audio Cable,
https://www.vb-audio.com/Cable/index.htm
 
and Banana (or Voicemeeter),
https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/banana.htm
https://www.vb-audio.com/Voicemeeter/
 
could be the ticket.
 
Using VoiceMeeter as the sound card source in Sonar, Cubase, Studio One etc
And then switching sound sources in the Voicemeeter drop down menu,
(Voicemeeter will be managing the drivers and not the DAW)
Would certainly take the strain off of DAW driver switching management.
If it manages them well enough.
 
It looks like Banana will let me use a DAW and two Keyboard USB audio sources simultaneously.
Will test this out tomorrow.  This is certainly worth a try.
 
If it works it makes sense to get a new computer.
 





I use vb-audio and pedalboard2 for Win audio to allow use of ARC2 outside of the DAW environment.  Please post back if you're able to go virtual in front of your DAW without latency and sync problems.
 
That would be very sweet, although I suspect clock drift between the various A/D converters will be a problem.  Hopefully not.
2018/08/12 18:55:45
Thedoccal
From the Banana Manual:
Looks like you can set two (of 3) outputs to different sources,
one ASIO (mixer, Sound Card) and one WDM (onboard computer audio)
https://screenshots.firef...9oExo/www.vb-audio.com
 
The next step is to turn every single device I have on, and see what shows up in this list:
https://screenshots.firefox.com/POqYMMsXod08oK6E/www.vb-audio.com
 
I'm reading the manual before I install anything, but this is looking good so far.
I really want to ask JunkieXL about this...
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