• Software
  • Pledge of $10/= each to purchase Fab Filter plug(s) to show appreciation to Bitflipper (p.9)
2014/02/05 02:30:43
tomixornot
Grem, 
 
Yup, got your PM too.
2014/02/05 17:33:10
Vastman
Wow! this is cool... I've gotten lots of bits from the flipper... count me it! Sent...gotta go do a "bit" of gardening to pay for it but nothing bitter about that!  
 
I think this is "fab"ulous!
2014/02/05 17:54:39
bitflipper
Grem
I have the complete Nomad bundle. And I also recently got the IK Total bundle. So what plug from FF would be more desirable to you if you were in this situation?



With the IK Total bundle you're really set for compressors and limiters, unless you just want to see what all the fuss is about with Pro-L - but I'd advise a demo before making that plunge. FabFilter gives you a full 30 days to demo. The demo's not crippled in any way, there are no annoying dropouts or noise bursts, and you can save/restore presets. The best demo policy around.
 
What you don't have in the IKM bundle is something like the uber-delay Timeless 2. Maybe you don't need it. I mean, in all honesty it's serious overkill for what most people do with delays. Watch Dan Worrall's videos (which only skim the surface) and if you're not scared off by those, then I'd suggest Timeless might fill a hole in your toolkit you didn't even know you had.
 
2014/02/05 23:11:58
cclarry
Vastman
Wow! this is cool... I've gotten lots of bits from the flipper... count me it! Sent...gotta go do a "bit" of gardening to pay for it but nothing bitter about that!  
 
I think this is "fab"ulous!



I see what you did there 
2014/02/06 00:39:02
Vastman
ah, shucks... it's my "forte"...
 
Bit... ur right... Timeless is exquisite!  I've got a bundle of costly delays... never use um anymore... T2 is just WOW!
 
curious about their Pro Q vs the sonar baby... I know my mixes need a lot of work and am thinkin' ProQ, which I can get for $100 cause I own volcano, T2 and their synth...  The left/rt vs center eqing is really interesting...might be the best tool at the moment for decluttering frequency clashes... then again, with the new X3 flyout... am I wasting my "bits"?
 
Just tryin' to get my "bits" worth of insight out of ya, flip!
2014/02/06 12:28:49
bitflipper
I'm in the camp that believes all EQs are the same. Well, that's a little too broad - differences do exist, but they are in the number of features and the user interface, just not in the filters themselves (assuming they're properly implemented). Pro-Q touts great filters (with a name like FabFilter they'd better be) but in truth there are plenty of high-end EQs out there with filters that are just as good. (Ignore anything you read about "cramping" near Nyquist - it doesn't apply to quality equalizers.)
 
Pro-Q will not magically make mixes sound better, any more than any other equalizer will. If you know what you're doing, SONAR's bundled EQs are more than adequate.
 
That said, I have to admit that Pro-Q is almost the only equalizer I use. Here's why:
 
1. Efficiency. Having 30 or 40 instances in a project is no problem, even on my low-spec machine. Part of this efficiency is from using your video adapter's GPU for graphical acceleration. With my other plugins that feature spectral animation, CPU usage is noticeably higher when the visuals are turned on. With Pro-Q there is no obvious difference in CPU whether the spectrum is enabled or not.
 
2. Ease-of-use. As with all FabFilter products, the UI is ergonomic, fast and friendly. For example, I use the band-solo feature a lot, and although that feature isn't unique to Pro-Q it's implemented very well. Using the mouse's scroll wheel to vary the bandwidth while soloing makes it easy to zero in on offensive resonances. Scroll wheel works for all knobs, too. There are other basic features that should be standard on all EQs but aren't, such as being able to type in precise values for any parameter, hiding controls that aren't needed, un-do and re-do, A/B comparison, and ctl-click reset. The UI size is just right, IMO: not too tiny for my old eyes, not so big that I can't fit several instances onscreen. The spectral display can be either pre- or post-EQ, and offers four vertical scalings. Metering is pretty good, too.
 
3. Mid/Side processing. Another feature you don't see on every EQ, and again very well-implemented. You can have any combination of filters that apply only to the Mid component, only to the Side, or both, and all are displayed together in a visually clear manner. Ozone's EQ, by comparison, also has M/S support but you can only see M or S at one time, so you can't easily see where they overlap. Before I had an M/S-aware EQ I didn't know what I was missing. Now I use it quite a lot, especially for mastering. You can also use Pro-Q as a broad M/S balance control for narrowing or widening the stereo image.
 
4. The Filters. Although some complain that Pro-Q lacks some filter options (e.g. no Baxandall) I don't miss them. Some of my other EQs such as Meldaproduction's MDynamicEQ and Voxengo's GlissEQ offer exotic filter types (e.g. band-shelf, harmonic series) but I rarely use them. Pro-Q lets you have up to 24 filters (!) with continuously-variable slopes up to 48dB/oct, so it's possible to create just about any shape you want. You can choose between linear- or minimum-phase, zero-latency or variable latency. Filters can be applied to just the left or right channels if needed. Everything can be automated.
 
What's missing from Pro-Q? Certainly nothing I need. Some whiners complain about the lack of upsampling, but they apparently don't understand what oversampling is for or they'd realize Pro-Q doesn't need it. A resizable UI would be nice, but as I said the existing size is just right for me. I've read complaints that Pro-Q is too clinical and adds no color - as if that was a weakness! If you want harmonic distortion, use a distortion plugin. GlissEQ remains unique in its ability to stack multiple spectra; Pro-Q doesn't have this, but AFAIK nobody else does, either. It would be a cool feature. Pro-Q is also not dynamic, but I think making a separate plugin was a smarter move than sticking it into Pro-Q.
 
That's about all I can say about Pro-Q at this time; the above is all from memory as I have no working DAW at the moment.
 
 
2014/02/06 14:39:17
Vastman
Now THAT answer is worth my $10 anyday.  I thank you so much, Bit!  you da man... told me everything I ever could want and...just cost me another $100!  I do wish more companies would go the resizable GUI route though, as my aging eyes often strain...products like Geist are virtually unusable to me anymore... am thinking of getting a third monitor and using low resolution just to move these dinky things to it to be able to use them.  Fortunately, Fab's stuff isn't so dinky and is very useable but an option like DIVA has would be nice.
 
Thanks again, sir...
 
In fact, if you end up getting close to the whole bundle by the deadline and no new blood steps up, I'll have to say your answer was worth 2 BITS and I'll contribute again!
 
BTW, your music is very nice...
2014/02/06 16:18:55
Grem
bitflipper
 
The best demo policy around.
 
What you don't have in the IKM bundle is something like the uber-delay Timeless 2. Maybe you don't need it. I mean, in all honesty it's serious overkill for what most people do with delays. Watch Dan Worrall's videos (which only skim the surface) and if you're not scared off by those, then I'd suggest Timeless might fill a hole in your toolkit you didn't even know you had.
 




Thanks Dave for the help. That demo policy does look good. Never knew that.  And to be honest, I have not gotten any of these plugs before because of price. I just couldn't justify the purchase. But every time you mentioned them I would go look at them!! I got the whole Nomad bundle and the IK bundle cheaper that the Timeless plug!!
 
The difference today was that on your advise I spent the time to watch Dan's video, and OMG!! That was just part one! What that plug can do is something I would have never thought of a delay doing!! The possibilities with just that one plug is phenomenal! I mean it just floored me!! I'm still stunned by the creativeness of that plug!!
 
And the way you describe the Pro Q plug has me very interested also. I'm going to watch that video as well.
 
I won't get all of them. It's just too much for what I do. What I have will do me fine. But I am definitely re-thinking my plug in strategy. Maybe just a few good plugs that have all the UI covered is better than all these choices I have now? Something to think about.
 
Again Dave, thanks for your insight.
 
2014/02/06 17:56:14
The Maillard Reaction
"What's missing from Pro-Q?"
 
I like to see all the numerical data of all the nodes all at once. 
 
I wish I could instantiate a Low Cut by placing a new node at the edge. I always get a Shelf and then have to change it to a cut with the drop down menu.
 
I wish the bar graph meter wasn't a tiny little thing hiding in the bottom corner.
 
Other wise, it's seems pretty complete.
2014/02/06 19:24:01
bitflipper
Yeh, I use a low cut much more often than a shelf. Easy solution, though: I just put in the low cut and saved it as the default so that every time I insert Pro-Q there's automatically a low-cut in place. 
 
A bigger meter would be nice, but I usually stick SPAN in at the end of the fx chain, regardless of which plugins preceed it. And of course in a pinch I understand that SONAR has some meters, too.
 
As for the "see all the numerical data of all the nodes all at once" wish, I agree that could be handy, but it's the price of an uncluttered display and high maximum node count. It's one of the things I like about Pro-Q versus traditional EQs that show all the knobs all the time (which is feasible only because of their small - and fixed - number of bands).
 
Checking each node without selecting is still very easy, just wave the mouse over them.
 
I did think of one other missing feature that would be nice, and that's displaying a frequency as a note value. That's a nifty feature of GlissEQ. But once again, SPAN provides that functionality too. SPAN is, after all, the spectral display portion of GlissEQ.
 
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