Is there any way to measure RMS (and A-weighted RMS) in Sonar - aside from estimating from the meter.  Like an actual number?

Not that I know of in Sonar.
 
You can run "Tools/statistics" in Sony Sound Forge and get the L/R RMS numbers on the entire wave file or just a high-lighted selection of it.
 
If you have Sound Forge it can be used within Sonar by selecting it from Sonar's "Utilities" menu.
You would be able to get an RMS number on any track in Sonar.
That would be the RMS value of the raw waveform without the track plugins contribution. 
 

There are several ways to do it for sure and using an editor program such as Adobe Audition etc will often include the ability to give you all sorts of readings including rms values.
 
Another way to do it is to calibrate your system to an rms ref level eg -14 db FS.  Insert a VU meter plugin and get it calibrated to show 0 db VU when a -14 dB FS signal is present.
 
Then play your master into the VU and see what is going on.  If it just hits 0 dB VU then you know your master is mastered to around -14 db FS.  If it falls short and only reaches -2 db VU then you know it is mastered to -16 dB FS rms level or if it hits + 3 db VU then you know it is mastered to -11 dB FS etc rms level.
 
Another option is to just insert a VU meter plugin  (some are very cheap eg Klanghelm meter and others are free too) and keep adjusting the ref level so the needle is just hitting 0 db VU most of the time.  Then read off the ref level.  That is what your master has been mastered to rms wise.  It might be high eg -10 etc..
 
Sonar's rms readings are 3 dB lower than what they should be.  A -14 dB FS rms signal shows up at -17 on the Sonar rms meter.  Be aware of that.  It is not accurate.  (Well actually it is accurate but it does not follow the standard of the rms level being the very tops of the sinewave, it is showing rms as being 3 dB down on peak which is technically correct but not so for this type of measurement though.)
 
 
 
 

Thanks for the suggestions.  Soundforge is little pricey for me.  Right now I have Audacity and can use Wave Stats to measure - the problem is that I have to export every time I want a measure.  That's kind of time consuming.  I'm a learner too so sometimes I just want to see how a minor change will affect things and I'm losing whole afternoons exporting files then making a minor switch and doing it again - what a drag.
 
Jeff, are any of the things you mentioned free?  I think a VU meter that's free would be great!  How do I calibrate my system?  I think one of the methods you mentioned might work for me.
 
Thanks!

mikebeam
Jeff, are any of the things you mentioned free?  I think a VU meter that's free would be great!

The Klanghelm meters are just a bit over 10$.
 
 

mikedocy
Not that I know of in Sonar.
 
You can run "Tools/statistics" in Sony Sound Forge and get the L/R RMS numbers on the entire wave file or just a high-lighted selection of it.
 
If you have Sound Forge it can be used within Sonar by selecting it from Sonar's "Utilities" menu.
You would be able to get an RMS number on any track in Sonar.
That would be the RMS value of the raw waveform without the track plugins contribution. 
 

Interesting, to the original poster you can get a cut-down version of SoundForge for 100 bucks or so...or even as part of their consumer Video editing package.  I've just had a look at the statistics at my last track...seems I should be making mine louder...gosh I'm only averaging -18db but it's better to be quieter than too loud.
 
Ben

Jeff Evans
There are several ways to do it for sure and using an editor program such as Adobe Audition etc will often include the ability to give you all sorts of readings including rms values.
 
Another way to do it is to calibrate your system to an rms ref level eg -14 db FS.  Insert a VU meter plugin and get it calibrated to show 0 db VU when a -14 dB FS signal is present.
 
Then play your master into the VU and see what is going on.  If it just hits 0 dB VU then you know your master is mastered to around -14 db FS.  If it falls short and only reaches -2 db VU then you know it is mastered to -16 dB FS rms level or if it hits + 3 db VU then you know it is mastered to -11 dB FS etc rms level.
 
Another option is to just insert a VU meter plugin  (some are very cheap eg Klanghelm meter and others are free too) and keep adjusting the ref level so the needle is just hitting 0 db VU most of the time.  Then read off the ref level.  That is what your master has been mastered to rms wise.  It might be high eg -10 etc..
 
Sonar's rms readings are 3 dB lower than what they should be.  A -14 dB FS rms signal shows up at -17 on the Sonar rms meter.  Be aware of that.  It is not accurate.  (Well actually it is accurate but it does not follow the standard of the rms level being the very tops of the sinewave, it is showing rms as being 3 dB down on peak which is technically correct but not so for this type of measurement though.)
 
 
 
 

Hi Jeff, now that I've discovered soundforges little tool, and I've found out I've been short changing my masters...although no one seems to be complaining about my mixes or masters anymore...what do you think...should I try and add 3 or more db to my masters.
I think I have been overmastering again...I've worked out that by proper gain staging or structure in the mix means less mastering...Virtually I just turn everything up and add a little sparkle...although I'm still having to carve the mids.  I would probably have to do even less if I just turned everything up another 3db.
Anyway your opinion would be nice...yes I said it would be nice.
 
Ben

Ben what sort of rms levels are you getting for your mixes now then. They sound pretty good to me but can you pin it down to a figure.

Hi Jeff...sorry went off to dinner...I had a look at my last piece...which has timing issues...I'm fixing them and that was -18db, one of the "classical" pieces was only -23db...I think I've figured the formula...maybe lol!!
 
Ben

Put Voxengo Span on your master buss or any track and get real-time RMS readout.
It's free:
http://www.voxengo.com/product/span/