2013/07/31 12:23:05
The Maillard Reaction
 
I have a example just like this that quenched my hunger for the famous Gretsch sound.
 

2013/07/31 12:29:54
drewfx1
Problem is it's not really the sound that drives most of the White Falcon's appeal for me. 
 
I contemplate putting some Filtertrons in something more affordable on occasion, but it wouldn't be the same.
2013/07/31 14:18:00
Starise
 Checked out USACG. Never knew they existed. I like the idea of rolling my own one day. It's tough to be discontent with something I pick out. 
 
 I hope I'm not off track again. If I am Spacey I hope you don't mind. On the subject of why certain makers pulled ahead of and were more popular than others.The patent definitely worked in favor of Gibson with the humbucker no doubt, at least for a short time. Seems that now tons of other makers found a way around it. I guess that has nothing to do with guitar prices per se, unless we could say that this lowered them slightly. The bucker plugged into someones Fender Bassman amp and that was all she wrote. 
 
 I was quoting a source on the lack of popularity of the Strat that I need to look up. It happened a little bit before my time so it isn't lived history for me. I remember reading in one of my guitar books that strats were dirt cheap and not especially recognized as great guitars for a time. It was only after Hendix and a few others came along that the strat really took off( according to the book). Not that it died but it wasn't extremely popular either.. TBO the electronics have come a long way since then. The shape is basically the same but there seem to have been a lot of small improvements  to the guitars over the years. 
 
 The Ricks were never my first choice but then maybe I didn't know how to treat one. They sounded too "clangy" to me. That sound fits well with some material but not so much with other.
2013/07/31 14:35:35
Rain
spacey
I grew up playing with a guitarist that played a Black Beauty.
 
I wasn't "into" Randy but I really liked his playing- I thought the "V"
was his main guitar. ? ( I don't know why I think that)
 
 
 
 
I know if I went to the store looking for one that I don't think I could
expect to find something like this from Gibson and I know that if I did
I'd pay no telling how much more for it and I also believe that it would
need to go to a luthier to get it setup for me.....when  I could have just
called a luthier from the start. Probably saved a lot of money and ended up
with a guitar that was built to fit and look as I wanted.
 
 
Here's one a "nobody" built. ( not me although I have had templates for one for years)
Personally I don't like the jack location or the fret dots but isn't that what is really cool...being
able to have little things changed to make it "right" ?
 
(magnetic control cavity cover and truss-rod cover- nice touch)
 
 






Judging from all the live pics and footage, he seemed to stick to 3 guitars: a white Les Paul, the custom Sandoval V and the white Jackson he designed, aka the concorde (which later got replaced by the black one, upgraded to his requirements).
 

 
Which is to say that he mostly played custom guitars, I guess.
 
I like that V on your pics - though I agree about the dots and the jack location. That's one guitar I'd like to add to my collection eventually - a V, custom built or other, I don't care much if it's an actual Gibson or not in that case.
2013/07/31 14:58:37
The Maillard Reaction
 
Here's an interesting book excerpt about George and John buying Strats in 1965:
 
http://books.google.com/books?id=Eo743Uh2UOEC&lpg=PA157&pg=PA157#v=onepage&q&f=false
 
I think Gerorge's comment about his Gretsch(s) is both funny and astute.
 
:-)
 
 
2013/08/01 10:32:00
Starise
 Interesting read Mike.
 
 I am surprised that the Beatles didn't use a strat with a white maple fret board. Clapton loved the simple varnished maple. According to him it was much easier to make  bends...this makes sense because on a grainy fret board you might be fighting the grain of the rosewood. Varnished white maple would have been like glass almost. Now I remember that it was an interview recently I read in a GC catalog where Clapton mentions that strats were not that popular for awhile.
 
 Here is probably more than you want to read on this. Some of these guys were alive and playing guitars in the mid 60's to early 70's. I was only a 10 in 1972 although that music had a great influence on me.
 
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/archive/index.php/t-489386.html
2013/08/01 11:08:21
michaelhanson
Georges comments where funny.  I also noticed his comments about they were lucky to get their hands on what ever they could.  I think that is exactly the way it was in the early years, they bought what they could find and afford.  I remember reading elsewhere, George saying that the Gretch was the first "real" guitar that he could get his hands on.
 
Why didn't they get maple fret boards on the Strats?  Interesting question, I don't think I have ever read anything on that topic that goes into that kind of detail.  I believe that they sent Brian Epstein out to get the Strats for them...could be he or they, just didn't have a preference at the time.  I know that I much prefer a maple fret board on a Strat.  
 
Starise...Interesting link and read that you posted there.  I noticed that Gibson has come out with an Eric Clapton, Les Paul as well; copy of the early years LP that he played. I have also seen a few YouTubes of EC playing a LP more/ on occasion again.
2013/08/01 11:10:25
spacey
Starise
 Interesting read Mike.
 
 I am surprised that the Beatles didn't use a strat with a white maple fret board. Clapton loved the simple varnished maple. According to him it was much easier to make  bends...this makes sense because on a grainy fret board you might be fighting the grain of the rosewood. Varnished white maple would have been like glass almost. Now I remember that it was an interview recently I read in a GC catalog where Clapton mentions that strats were not that popular for awhile.
 
 Here is probably more than you want to read on this. Some of these guys were alive and playing guitars in the mid 60's to early 70's. I was only a 10 in 1972 although that music had a great influence on me.
 
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/archive/index.php/t-489386.html




Man Star...I sure don't want to shoot down your points of view but I sure see things differently.
First...everybody has their reasons for thinking the way they do...and that's cool.
 
There are two main factors when it comes to bending strings on a guitar. One is the radius of the fretboard and the other is the fret height. When a guitar has low frets the guitarist may have bending issues because of two main reasons. It's hard to get "under" the string and then having to push the string on the fretboard. When the frets are to low and one is having to work against the board then the type of wood is such a very small factor that the difference is mostly that maple usually has a finish and rosewood doesn't...nothing really about woodgrain is an issue...of course should one believe there is that is fine by me.
If woodgrain is an issue then there are bigger problems than string bending at hand.
Should I have low frets I would without doubt prefer the natural oily rosewood over a plastic coated maple. YMMV.
 
"Varnished white maple would have been like glass almost"  - if that's true then why do most guitarist remark about  necks feeling sticky- from being plastic coated and prefer oiled necks? There are also many treatment tips for players to relieve some of that problem with plastic coated necks/fretboards.
 
Now what I'm not sure of is; Are you referring to nitrocellulose lacquers, polyurethane or oil (varnish) finishes?
I'm inclined to think you are referring to Fenders finishes which are not oil (varnish)
 
Linseed oil or tung oil (which is what I prefer, "Tru-oil") are varnishes because they are reactive finishes - meaning that they change into a hard film by exposure to air (oxygen) not by the evaporation of the solvent like lacquer or shellac.   These oil varnishes are probably the earliest and simplest wood finishes and the natural luster, or glow, of  wood under an oil finish is very appealing and most players love the natural feel on their guitar necks.
Maybe Clapton had an oiled (varnished) neck of which he was referring...I don't know.
 
 
There have without doubt been at least three poplular electric guitars since they were marketed.
The Tele, LP and Strat. I am not aware of anytime that Gibson or Fender had a slump in sales based on lack of popularity.
 
 
 
 
2013/08/01 11:14:11
The Maillard Reaction
Isn't Clapton the guy that discovered that Michael Bloomfield had discovered 1958 Les Pauls sounded great? 
 
The Beatles used their Strats on Rubber Soul... which is probably number 2 or so on my all time favorite records list.
 
One reason the Beatles say they held off on buying Strats until that time is that they wanted to purposefully avoid comparison to the wildy popular Shadows and Hank Marvin, a contemporary guitar hero that made prominent use of Strats.
 
They did that in 1965.
 
Jimi bought his first Strat in '66.
 
Eric Clapton recorded with Bluesbreakers in 1966 and blew the doors wide open for an appreciation of a humbucker equipped Les Paul that is pushing the inputs of a guitar amp. He's sort for famous for making it iconic as a rock instrument. Most folks missed the Mike Bloomfield connection.
 
That's probably why Jimmy Page transitioned from the Telecaster he was ripping on to the Les Paul... to join in on the fun.
 
 
 
 
 
I haven't disagreed with the idea that a lot of folks say the Strat wasn't popular... I've heard people say that many times.
 
The Tele and Strat are the #1 and #2 longest running, never ceased production, solid body guitar models in the history of the planet.
 
I think you have to define some very narrow contexts to support any ideas that they ebbed and flowed in fashion once or twice in that time span. I'm sure people experienced this to be true to their experience... but it seems more isolated when you take the time to see what was going on in a broader sense.
 
best regards,
mike
 
 
2013/08/01 12:06:47
michaelhanson
here are two main factors when it comes to bending strings on a guitar. One is the radius of the fretboard and the other is the fret height. When a guitar has low frets the guitarist may have bending issues because of two main reasons. It's hard to get "under" the string and then having to push the string on the fretboard. When the frets are to low and one is having to work against the board then the type of wood is such a very small factor that the difference is mostly that maple usually has a finish and rosewood doesn't...nothing really about woodgrain is an issue...

 
Three fingers usually work best for bending as well.  
 
I first discovered the "size of fret-wire" influence with an American Deluxe Strat that I had a few years ago.  What a difference medium jumbo frets made for ease of bending.  I would think that preference of rosewood or maple fret board would be more for tone.....and looks.
 
I am not sure what clear finish Fender is currently using on the brand new Mexican-made Strats, but I really like it much better than the prior thick clear finish.  My hands would kind of stick to the old finish.  I believe the Deluxe that I had, had more of a "gun-oil" finish.  I loved the neck on that Strat...was like butter.
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