ORIGINAL: studiopl
...Just incase, how would no support effect the plugins?

Unfortunately the reality of waves' new licensing agreement (called "WUP") is such that you really cannot use waves long-term without paying a subscription fee and periodically getting them to issue you a new registration. For instance if you upgrade your computer or replace a hard drive or some such you have to get a new key from them, which you can only get if you are signed up for a fairly pricey subscription. Clearly if they went out of business or could not offer support this would be a problem.

(search WUP for the gruesome details on their turgid history with the new licensing scheme)

Cheers.

Actually, I think that they changed the WUP pricing scheme, so that even on the highest end packages it was limited to a couple hundred bucks a year, and scales down from there. That's my understanding anyway.

That's still bad news though. No long term security in terms of the purchases you make...

Then again if small developers such as Voxengo or Kjaerhus went down, I'm not sure what the deal would be <shrug>

Even if they got bought... well, look what happened with the whole Roger Nichols thing. :(

ORIGINAL: droddey

Actually, I think that they changed the WUP pricing scheme, so that even on the highest end packages it was limited to a couple hundred bucks a year, and scales down from there. That's my understanding anyway.

Woo-hoo!

I bailed on them after they raped me for the WUP on products I had paid good money for years earlier. Nice to hear they're using lubricant these days.

Great plugins, awful company. They were once the only game in town but those days are long gone. I thought I would miss them a lot more than I did. Only hard part of dropping waves was dealing with the inconvenience of all my pre-existing projects that had their plugins.

Cheers.

For a professional outfit that paid $7500 for the full smash system, $200 a year wouldn't even be worth noting. It's obviously not the same for individuals. As long as they keep adding plugs to the packages in return for the WUP, I'm not going to stress about it.

ORIGINAL: droddey

For a professional outfit that paid $7500 for the full smash system, $200 a year wouldn't even be worth noting. It's obviously not the same for individuals. As long as they keep adding plugs to the packages in return for the WUP, I'm not going to stress about it.

I respectfully disagree. For a professional outfit to be jerked around the way that waves jerked me around is an insult.

If waves had required an annual subscription when I bought it then I probably would have paid, because at the time they were the only real option for comprehensive, versatile, top-quality effects. But to come back after the deal is done and say they've changed their mind and now I have to pay more to use a product I already bought free and clear and had been using for years is profoundly unprofessional IMVHO.

i'm sure there's some roundabout explanation that makes it legal and references all the fine print that I willingly clicked "agree" to, but as a businessman I will not do business with cheap hustlers who pull stuff like that, if I can help it. The message it sent loud and clear was that they did not value my business, loyalty, or any of it, and they saw me solely as a cash cow to be bled dry.

If other people value the extras that waves offers in return for the WUP then great. I did not. I didn't want or seek extra plugins or customer service or enhanced support, I just wanted to use the plugins that I had already paid for.

If cakewalk came back to me and announced that they were going to cripple my copy of Sonar unless I paid them more money I'd feel the same way. It would be outrageous if anyone did it.

It's not about the dollar amount (although I believe it was considerably more than $200), that's just salt in the wound. If they'd demanded $10/year I'd feel the same way. Whatever the legalese in the license said, I paid a big chuck of change to them for product and the spirit and the intent of the transaction was clear at the time, and waves clearly changed the rules.

The notion that it shouldn't matter to a business is a little insulting, frankly. A small businessperson's paycheck is very often whatever is left over after all the bills are paid. Wherever the $200 shows up on the books it's ultimately money that's not in my pocket.

And please understand, I am not complaining about people who have purchased waves *with* the WUP-- they made the evaluation and decided it was worth it. I'm talking about those of us who bought waves before the WUP and then had our license agreements changed after the fact.

Cheers.

Hi there,

Re some kind of studio rating

To my mind, as a musician, if I go to a recording studio, my first concern is usually about whether I can work with the guys. I'll maybe go and visit them beforehand and speak to them about my project and see what their response is.

Unfortunately, a lot of them don't actually listen and I can pick this up fairly quickly. What I have found is a lot of ego crap regarding the wonders they can do with the great gear (software / plugins) they have.

Like I'm supposed to know the sound of a `wave` or other particular plugin. My job is the music, their job is to record it! As long as the end product sounds good to me as the client, then I really don't care what plugins they use, I ain't paying them to educate me or recommend I use the latest `plug` in the `session`.

A studio rating re gear means F/all to me, If they use cracked software, it's their heads not mine. Neither is it my responsibility as a client to any `developer` to ask if the gear is legit! in any studio I go to. A client can make the assumption for themselves if they so wish but I doubt if many musicians actually do.

I would reiterate my post on another thread re waves that I think there is an over-dependancy on the whole Software DAW thing and especially with plugins. Of course my view is based on my own experiences with audio software, but there is still a lot to be said for using `outboard` processing which I'm turning very quickly back onto.

EQ is EQ, Gate is Gate, REV is REV.....and so on!

Just my 2 cents

Cheers
pkev

q

I just also switched over to the Ren EQ/Comp and they are really nice. So now my current project is Ren EQ/Comp, C1 gate, Q10 in a couple players where just a clean EQ is required), IR-L reverb, MaxBass, and the doubler, imager, flanger, and enigma. I'll add C4 and de-esser when the time comes for vocals. There will probably be some places where I still use my Kjearhus EQ and comp. I'm not sure if Ren Comp is necessarily optimum for the master buss or not, I'll have to compare it to the Kjearhus, which is more dialable. But overall, I'm really happy with this configuration, and basically you can do serious work just with the Gold bundle and nothing else.

As I was saying in another thread, I downloaded the URL N/S EQs, the demos, this morning and played with them. They were nice, but for another $500, I can get so close with Ren EQ that it's just not worth the difference to me at this point. Layter I may pick them up if have some money to burn, which doesn't happen very often these days though.

q