• SONAR
  • Setting buffer size on sound card and SONAR (p.3)
2009/07/05 12:08:28
CJaysMusic
anyways here's the skinny. i was able to get rid of my 2, 1 GB ram sticks at work in exchange for 2, 2 GB sticks. for some reason it only claims 3 GB ram, but someone here at my work claims that's because it's not a 64 bit system (only vista is?). whatever that means. if it really only can take 3 i don't know why work would have let me install them. so maybe that extra 1 is doing something... but who knows.

It means that all 32bit windows can only see no more than 4 gigs. and if your seeing 3 gigs, then you need to enable the 3gig switch and take into account that your video card takes up ram also. In 64bit windows, it can see as much as 16gigs, i think
Cj
2010/01/04 18:59:35
Elu
nollies1


OK...

I have systematically gone through all combinations between what I can set on the card and what I can set in SONAR...well, I went up to 1024 on the card and 768 in SONAR... all present the same symptoms of mild but noticeable drops.

I kept my eye on the CPU and Disk % usage and they are always quite low (no more than a FEW %). I am beginning to wonder if there is another cause.

Prior to me trying to figure out this buffer size issue I have also: a) set windows for "best performance"; b) got a 'dedicated' firewire adapter (for the project mix); and c) all the random stuff like different cables, disabled IRQs, unplugged the cord to my laptop, etc. Oh and I reinstalled the software too, and all updates as well.

Any other thoughts on how to troubleshoot? Thanks

I have the same issues with latency and such just finishing a new 64 bit installation with all software running in 64 bit as well.  It will just take some time to work out the latency issues.  However what I noticed about this particular post is that you said you set windows for "best performance", however it must be said that sound drivers work in the background not in the foreground.  So setting your computer for best performance does not help latency issues, it hinders them.  It would be more prudent to set your computer to run background services as the more important processes.  Cakewalk itself will run fine.  This is something that I picked up from M-Audio.
2010/01/05 02:23:06
doctorweir
Also run DPC Latency Checker http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml
and look out for latency spikes. These also contribute to the pops/clicks and can originate from various sources, e.g. LAN card, windows sidebar, gadgets, system hardware monitoring tools, antivir, etc.
I also nearly freaked out on the latency till I figured out to switch the windows sidebar and Everest off!!!
So switch on DPC lat and play around a bit, ending processes, switching off devices, etc...
2017/09/04 21:40:02
jasonthelegend
Wow, your latency results are much better than mine with a Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 connected via USB 3.1 [Thunderbolt 3]. Something that many people using USB interfaces don't realize is that if you have multiple usb devices or hubs connected to your system, it uses all of the available bandwidth on the Universal Serial Bus. That's why I opted to use my only USB 3.1 port for the 18i20. Windows 10 wouldn't even recognize the Scarlett until I disconnected all my USB devices. Even with just my 4k webcam connected, the camera wouldn't work because the Scarlett was using all my bandwidth. The USB 3.1 port has it's own dedicated bus so that fixed the problem there at least. Unfortunately my ASIO latency is 12.5 milliseconds for both input and output using 551 samples. When I increased the sample to 1024, the latency increased to 24.5 milliseconds.
 
Anyways, the last thing that I wanted to mention is that Windows WILL recognize a max of 4GB of RAM. If you don't have a video card with dedicated graphics memory then oftentimes the OS will reserve 1GB of your physical RAM to run graphics. A semi-workaround might be to increase the size of your paging file to act as virtual memory. This will allow a place for the memory usage that exceeds your available RAM to go. Here's the catch, virtual memory is limited to the speed of your hard drive, so when your system does use it, there is a drastic difference in speed. Upgrading to a solid state drive might help. They are 2.5" which fits perfectly in laptops. SSDs don't use paging files (at least you aren't supposed to) because they are always in a solid state of either read or write. I'm sure that people may disagree with me, but I do actually have a Bachelor's in Computer Science with Specialization in Computer Security so I know one or two things here and there. As for Audio Engineering, I literally just started last week. I know absolutely nothing on the subject. I bought my computer 3 years ago so I didn't go out and buy something fancy. I don't use Mac computers due to my own personal issues with the company, however, I figured out a way to run the latest macOS build in a virtual machine just in case I need to use a program that is only built for the macOS. Also, you have a Core 2 Duo which does support a 64 bit OS, and honestly, your performance will increase drastically if you were to switch. Just some ideas. 
 
I would love to get some more ideas as to correcting my latency. I'm also having trouble with the WDM driver. I can't even switch to it in Sonar because it causes an instant blue screen of death every time. So I'm forced to use ASIO. This is way out of my realm as I do not understand ASIO or WDM. The only reason that I tried switching to WDM is because Sonar is only showing half of my inputs, but unlike other Scarlett users, my list of inputs and outputs do not say "left" or "right" input so it's hard to believe that it is only showing stereo connections, although, it is detecting exactly half of the inputs and outputs. It's not like I will ever use all of my inputs/outputs because I'm just operating out of my bedroom, as I was injured badly in combat and I can no longer walk so I'm in my bed 24/7. I have set everything up around where I lay. Anyways, I said way more than I intended. I hope that you stay well. 
 
Take Care,
Jason
 
**Crap! I just now realized that this thread is 7 years old so it probably won't help anyone. I'm going to post it anyways because I took a lot of time to write it. Sorry everyone.**
 
____________________________________________________________________________________________
SONAR Platinum (23.7.0) Build 37 [07-2017] 
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 (USB 3.1 [Thunderbolt 3])
Audio-Technica ATH W5000 
Alienware 15 R2 Laptop
Windows 10 Enterprise x64 
Intel Core i7 6920 Skylake (8 cores) (4.1GHz [Overclocked],1000MHz FSB, 6MB Cache/1024MB L2 Cache) 
32GB DDR4 2133 MHz RAM
1TB Samsung NVMe PM951 M.2 PCIe SSD (Boot/Programs)
1TB 7200RPM Seagate HTS721010A9E630 (SATA 6 Gbps) [Storage]
5TB 7200RPM Seagate SCSI USB 3.0 Expansion Drive
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980M (4GB GDDR5 @ 2500 MHz) PCIe 3.0
Intel(R) HD Graphics 530
2017/09/04 22:36:53
chuckebaby
You should be using the driver you downloaded for your Focusrite 1820. The ASIO driver. that will get you the best results and lowest latency. Some might argue WASAPI but disagree. Use the ASIO Drivers that came with your device. there is no reason you cant get more than acceptable results using the ASIO driver for your scarrlett.
2017/09/05 01:08:36
BRainbow
 
Hi Jason,
 
Welcome to SONAR. ++1 on Chuck-E's advice to use the Scarlett's included ASIO drivers (and then update them from the website).
 
You said:  <<<Windows WILL recognize a max of 4GB of RAM.>>>
Do I misunderstand?  I definitely don't think this is true.
 
Your input/output list may seem like you are only getting half the ins/outs because it shows something like "Scarlet Input Device 1"  when it is actually Scarlett 1 and 2.  They are stereo by default, but the default naming is confusing.   You can rename all your ins/outs to make it less so -- just check "use friendly names" and double click on and edit the existing name  I just use "Z 1-2" for my Zoom and "O 1-2" for my Mackie Onyx interfaces - it's short and easily fits in the inputs/outputs window in Track View.
 
Good luck.  There is a lot to learn but digital recording/engineering with SONAR is addictive in the best possible way.
 
Aloha,
Bill
2017/09/05 20:06:26
jasonthelegend
Thanks for the advice guys. I am running the latest driver directly from Focusrite. I actually had a Focusrite tech log into my system remotely, and he ensured that everything was set up right. It took us a while to figure out that it was the overload of the Universal Serial Bus that was causing the problem. Honestly, it was the very last thing that came to my mind because I've never overloaded the bus before; never in all my years of working with computers has this happened. It makes a lot of sense though because with the 18i20 you are connecting 38 inputs/outputs that need to be ready to receive signal at any given time. Per your advice, I will stick with ASIO, and thank you for confirming that it sees the inputs as stereo connections. That's kind of what I thought, but it presented itself differently than what other people were experiencing so I doubted my gut instinct.
 
As for 32 bit Windows recognizing 4GB of RAM, back in the day it wouldn't show it at all, however, as the years have gone by, manufacturers began releasing BIOS updates that would fix it. I'm not sure if they have released updates for the Lenovo or not. Also, if you do NOT have a dedicated graphics card then Windows oftentimes reserves 1GB for video. One quick way to see if it is recognizing all of your physical RAM is to run Hardware Monitor by CPUID. You can Google it or I will attempt to paste a link: 
The free version will do the trick. You can also right click on "My Computer" or for newer versions of Windows you would open up file explorer and right click on "This PC", then select the "Advanced" tab, then choose the options you want. I would suggest that you select the option to configure the computer for Performance rather than letting Windows decide. Then I would select the options to allocate memory for programs rather than background processes. You can also adjust your paging file here. In my totally honest technical opinion, I would upgrade to a 64 bit OS and select the 64 bit precision checkbox in Sonar under Drivers. Hope this helps.
 
Take Care,
J
 
2017/11/21 09:55:34
GregGraves
I've always wondered (though I experience no problems) that if when I'm mixing (not recording) I set the playback buffer to 512 and the record buffer to 512, does that mean that my soundcard buffer should be the sum of those two values, i.e., 1024?  In any case, that is why I read through this post, being bored and can't sleep.
 
RE: Jasonthelegend's post
 
I bought an M-Audio M-Track USB interface to use with my admittedly crappy laptop while on the road, and never could get the latency down to what I'm spoiled with my ancient PCI card stuck in my ancient Win7 motherboard in the studio, namely inaudible latency of a couple msec.   I found USB unusable.  It sits, brand new and unused, in a box on the shelf!
 
I realize that people do get these USB interfaces to work, so you should be able to get yours to work, given the power of your system, which far outpaces my mid-tower PC.  I suggest setting your buffers at 512.  I imagine Playback will be good, but latency with your guitar (?) will give you brain damage.  You can then reduce buffer size by steps of 128 until Playback begins to stutter but latency has improved. 
 
If this doesn't solve your problem, then your problem is due to something else.  Duh.  If you are trying to record guitar through a plugin to get the sound you want, I've never been able to get that to work.  Other than stick a mic in front of an amp, I use either my Behringer V-amp or Line6 rackmount guitar processors.  What I hear is what I get.  The line6 also has a direct bypass line-out, so if I want to use a plugin, I can set the Line6 (or whatever) to mimic the sound of the plugin, but only use the plugin on the dry recorded sound after I'm done laying down my parts.  I wonder if that is the problem you are having.....
 
As far as posting on here, folks generally try to be helpful, unlike the Dodge RAM forum where everyone seems to think it is their job to flame.  So if you get stuck, post.  I've been doing this stuff since Windows 95 came out and I sold all my multitrack tape machines.  I still get stuck and have to post.
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